Comments on: Jesus and the Children of Empire

By: Jesus and the Children of Empire « Young Adult Catholics

Jesus and the Children of Empire « Young Adult Catholics — Sat, 24 Oct 2009 18:36:03 +0000

[...] Posted by Cesar Baldelomar on October 24, 2009 Note: This article was originally published at Sojourners’ God’s Politics blog: http://blog.sojo.net/2009/04/03/jesus-and-the-children-of-empire/ [...]

By: mazbeth

mazbeth — Mon, 11 May 2009 08:03:34 +0000

sorry not to adress more – as I am busy, but the headline caught my eye
He was not a Palestinian Jew, but an Israeli one.
The term Palestine was given as an insult, by the Romans, centuries after Jesus

By: laurentikkun

laurentikkun — Fri, 01 May 2009 20:50:26 +0000

Recognizing the anti-imperial strands of Jesus' life and teachings can make them more near and dear to those whose lives have been strongly flavored by oppression, and can help to explain the trends you mention of Christianity's rise in the Global South. For those who take this picture of Jesus' message seriously, it can also seriously inform a call to contemporary anti-imperialism, as you say. The article “Owning Our Involvement in Colombia's Complex War” by John Lindsay-Poland in Tikkun Magazine is one example of political analysis that is informed by spiritual values. It touches on issues of imperialism and Latin America, describing the history of U.S. intervention in Colombia and denouncing the effects of U.S. policies:

http://www.tikkun.org/article.php/2009022523495...

By: C_Baldelomar

C_Baldelomar — Sat, 11 Apr 2009 00:53:00 +0000

Thanks, ail28, for your comment!

By: ail28

ail28 — Thu, 09 Apr 2009 01:30:21 +0000

I really enjoyed reading your post. I think you bring to light very important issues for the world today.

Thank you for your post!

By: C_Baldelomar

C_Baldelomar — Thu, 09 Apr 2009 01:24:14 +0000

Thanks for your kind words! Even though I do not respond to each comment, I do read and learn plenty from each one of them. Thanks for reading, and I look forward to continuing the dialogue!

-Cesar

By: squeaky

squeaky — Mon, 06 Apr 2009 20:59:53 +0000

Hey–thanks for hanging out and reading and responding to the comments to your post! So often, the posters here don't do that, and I really wish there was more participation and conversation with those who got the conversation rolling in the first place. I think it would make this blog more dynamic. Thanks! Thanks also for the thought-provoking post!

By: WaveTossed

WaveTossed — Mon, 06 Apr 2009 17:21:25 +0000

You wrote: "Marginalization and persecution are pretty self-centered concepts. Do you think Jesus, on the cross, was thinking--'I have chosen marginalization and persecution??'

Not explicitly when He was on the cross. However, earlier, Jesus did have a few words to say about persecution:

Matthew Chapter 5:

"10 Blessed are they which are persecuted for righteousness' sake: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven. 11 Blessed are ye, when men shall revile you, and persecute you, and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, F8 for my sake. 12 Rejoice, and be exceeding glad: for great is your reward in heaven: for so persecuted they the prophets which were before you."

By: letjusticerolldown

letjusticerolldown — Mon, 06 Apr 2009 15:31:48 +0000

You, my dear friend, came into this world naked and will leave the same. You ain't goin' to take one thing with ya'. Except an eternal, complete fellowship with Abba--and a blessed place beyond comprehension.

We are all stripped.

Count it all joy....whenever you face trials.....

God issues many invitations in life. The invitation to lay down one's life is going to come in a hundred different forms. Sometimes we realize the invitation is there. Sometimes it creates an internal turmoil. Other times we simply respond yes and do not realize we did it.

There is a grace and provision that comes with the invitations. I have done many things in life that look like sacrifice to others-that occur to me simply as blessings.

Marginalization and persecution are pretty self-centered concepts. Do you think Jesus, on the cross, was thinking--"I have chosen marginalization and persecution??"

He set aside all to be what---marginalized or unified??

So I think the journey demands an openness to seeing, receiving and lovingly saying "yes" to the invitations of God--and having a gratitude for both the invitations and the grace to respond.

I wonder if your question is not taking on the expectations of some other people whom in the course of saying yes to the invitations of Jesus--have taken their journeys and turned them into a legalism or a standard for you and others to meet. Don't strive to achieve the journey of another. Take their journey as encouragement and guidance; but your response must be to the invitations of God, confident in His grace, and compelled by his love.

By: WaveTossed

WaveTossed — Mon, 06 Apr 2009 13:58:38 +0000

I wrote: "Michael Schwerner, Andrew Goodman"

You wrote: "several examples of faithful followers of Christ"

Michael Schwerner and Andrew Goodman were Jewish. They didn't explicitly follow Christ. However, even though they didn't explicitly follow Jesus, yet they practiced the Way of Jesus by fighting for social justice.

By: WaveTossed

WaveTossed — Mon, 06 Apr 2009 13:50:13 +0000

No, you don't have to become a martyr or face persecution in order to be able to follow Christ. You only have to be willing to face these things. It's not inevitable that you will face adversities; it's just possible.

By: BlueDeacon

BlueDeacon — Mon, 06 Apr 2009 13:00:29 +0000

I think you have it right. No one should actually seek persecution; however, a true follower of Christ eventually will experience it at some point. In Charles Colson's “Loving God,” he tells the story of a Polish cardinal who was imprisoned for speaking out against the repressive Communist regime. Noting that he alone of his seminary classmates had escaped jail, he wryly said (my paraphrase), “What took them so long to bust me?”

By: BlueDeacon

BlueDeacon — Mon, 06 Apr 2009 12:53:52 +0000

Brilliant. That's all I can say about your post — spoken from a perspective that has “been there, done that.”

By: Med_Stonewall

Med_Stonewall — Mon, 06 Apr 2009 03:24:02 +0000

Your response brings up a related question that I have also thought about for a while. You mention several examples of faithful followers of Christ who didn't necessarily come from marginalized backgrounds, but yet became marginalized because of their faith. The question I have is, will following Christ always inevitably lead to persecution/marginalization? Best I can tell, Scripture seems to indicate that this is the case. However, these Scriptures were written to people (i.e. the persecuted, those occupied by a foreign, malevolent government, those viewed as lowly in the world's eyes, etc) for whom this would obviously definitely happen. I feel as though I am authentically seeking to follow Christ, but yet I have experienced no persecution/marginalization. I have known many people who have, best I can tell, lived Christ-centered lives. Does this mean that we are not authentically seeking Christ in some way? Or should we view persecution and marginalization more as something that the authentic Christian may experience but not that they inevitably will?

By: Med_Stonewall

Med_Stonewall — Mon, 06 Apr 2009 03:05:10 +0000

Thank you very much for your post. You are right in saying that its not so much our position in life that's important, but the way we view our position. Its not as important what we've been given, but what we do with it.

By: hammerud

hammerud — Sun, 05 Apr 2009 22:36:16 +0000

No argument that social injustice is sin, but human efforts to rid the world of social injustice will never solve the problem of social injustice because of sin. The reality (not an excuse for inactivity) is that social injustice will never be solved until Christ reigns, beginning with the millenium. Social injustice definitely should be opposed, but not at the expense of the gospel message. In many humanitarian activities done in the name of Christ, the gospel is not communicated. The author states, “Jesus’ gospel is perhaps losing its radical edge.” That may be the case, but a greater danger is that Jesus' gospel is lost because of a total focus on the radical edge. Do a lot of these people who are helped, ever gain an understanding of the gospel — that we are sinful and separated from God; that Christ died for our sins and by placing one's trust in Him we find acceptance with God? There is an interesting account in the gospels of the judgment where people stood before God and said, “Lord, Lord, have we not done this in your name and that in your name” (paraphrase), and the response is “depart from me because I never knew you.” The point is that a lot of people can do things in the name of Christ, things that are good, that, in reality from God's point of view, have nothing to do with Christ. I'm not saying that this is the case here, but I'm not sure.

By: WaveTossed

WaveTossed — Sun, 05 Apr 2009 20:03:32 +0000

Sin and social injustice are certainly NOT mutually exclusive. Social injustice is a sin.

By: hammerud

hammerud — Sun, 05 Apr 2009 18:29:44 +0000

You rightly point out that ” the focus in these wealthy countries is more on personal spirituality, personal sin, and personal salvation.” I just was thinking though that Jesus primary focus was not on implementing some form of social justice, opposing oppressive authorities, and helping all of the world's poor — all legitimate things to do, and things that, as God, He had the power to do (and, by the way, in the fullness of time, will do); His primary focus in His first coming was resolution of the sin issue, His purpose for coming to this world at that time; and the core reason for all of the injustice and inequity in the world. His focus was on the problem not the symptoms. That is why He said to Nicodemus, “you must be born again.” This doesn't in any way mean we should not be concerned for these social issues (and you are to be greatly commended for your efforts), but it does mean we should understand the difference between the disease (sin) and the symptoms (injustice), and we are called primarily to present the answer to the disease, which is “ye must be born again.”

By: WaveTossed

WaveTossed — Sun, 05 Apr 2009 17:25:44 +0000

Med_Stonewall:

I think you might be able to find the answer here. Jesus said:

"Matthew 19:23-30
23 Then said Jesus unto his disciples, Verily I say unto you, That a rich man shall hardly enter into the kingdom of heaven. 24 And again I say unto you, It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God. 25 When his disciples heard it, they were exceedingly amazed, saying, Who then can be saved? 26 But Jesus beheld them, and said unto them, With men this is impossible; but with God all things are possible."

One doesn't have to be poor or marginalized to enter into the Kingdom of Heaven. Jesus said that it was very difficult for the rich to understand. But then He said that with God, all things are possible.

I happen to be a member of a marginalized minority (Gay/Lesbian people). However, I know many, many people who are neither poor, female, or members of marginalized minorities who understand and practice Jesus' Word. Just let yourself go and follow Jesus' Word and you will understand.

In fact, as a follower of justice (Jesus' Word involves justice), you will likely find yourself marginalized. Many of the martyrs for justice were people just like you: relatively comfortable middle-class people who reached out to practice justice. Examples that I know of are: Michael Schwerner, Andrew Goodman, Jonathan Daniels, Rev. Jim Reeb: these are among the many people who gave up their lives to fight for civil rights for Black people in the 1960s. Then there is Frank Moscone, Mayor of San Francisco, who along with his colleague Harvey Milk, gave up his life to fight for Gay civil rights.

In Latin American, there was Bishop Oscar Romero, who came from a comfortable background who was martyred for standing up for the poor. This happens all over the world.

As a Christian: welcome to the world of the marginalized.

By: C_Baldelomar

C_Baldelomar — Sat, 04 Apr 2009 16:59:00 +0000

Thank you for your comment.