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Jack Kemp: Bleeding-Heart Conservative

In 1965, in a last minute move, the American Football League switched its All-Star game from New Orleans to Houston. In New Orleans, black football players had been denied entry to restaurants and taxi cabs because of the color of their skin and had begun a boycott in protest. A star quarterback, who was also the founder and president of the AFL players union, named Jack Kemp, refused to sit idly by in the face of racism, supported the boycott, and helped to get the game moved. Former football player Ernie Ladd told The Washington Post, "The only white who would take a stand was Jack Kemp. He made it known he wasn't for that type of activity." Jack Kemp thought racism was both stupid and wrong, and consistently stood up against it when few other white celebrities or leaders did. From both the sporting and political worlds, he and Bill Bradley stand out in that commitment-one a Republican and one a Democrat.

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Jack Kemp died on Saturday at the age of 73, and he will be remembered and missed by many. He served from 1971 to 1989 as a congressman from New York and for four years after that as President George H. W. Bush's Housing and Urban Development Secretary. Kemp was a fervent believer in "supply side economics," which I just as fervently oppose. But you do not have to agree with all of Jack Kemp's economic policies to be impressed and inspired with his life and leadership. He championed what some called "bleeding-heart conservatism," and for his work on civil rights he was often hailed as a true Lincoln-style Republican. Jack Kemp was one of very few white politicians held in high esteem by many African Americans, and one of the very few Republicans of his era who was trusted by the black community.

He was strict in his adherence to conservative principles but often found common ground with veteran housing advocates working with and on behalf of those stuck in failed urban housing projects. His commitment to the principles of economic opportunity for the poor, and ownership and investment in blighted neighborhoods, made him a practical and pragmatic ally for those committed to transforming urban neighborhoods.

I had a few good conversations with Jack Kemp, and he was always very positive about the work we were trying to do on poverty and racism. He was less a partisan politician than a principled one. I thank God for Jack Kemp, perhaps one of the earliest pioneers of "compassionate conservatism." In his passing, I pray that his legacy would increase -- both of finding common ground with those with whom he disagreed on many things and of increasing opportunity for all of God's children. Jack will be remembered as both a lesson and an example for political leaders of the future.

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by: jeffp

05-08-2009 @ 4:18pm

If you really wanted to make a strong argument you'd just say "Their words not mine"

Keep posting justontime, I love what your saying

by: BlueDeacon

05-05-2009 @ 2:17pm

Sadly, even Kemp at times was considered a sellout by his own party, but he demonstrated the possibilities of reaching across the ideological divide to address real problems. There's a reason blacks trusted him -- he actually talked to, not simply at or about, them.

by: xfree9

05-05-2009 @ 2:17pm

Thanks, Jim, for what I observe as a genuine attitude of goodwill toward a man with whom you found disagreement but could validate his life and passions. I hope you continue to think and write about others with whom you disagree in a favorable manner, even if there are points of disagreement.

by: 1Grace

05-05-2009 @ 3:38pm

Thanks Jim. jack kemp was so glad when Reagan was elected and his beliefs of opportunity for all gave way to one of the biggest economic booms in our history .
He was saddened at the sell out of the many principles you mentioned about recent republican methods in the Bush Administration making compassion sometimes just a word instead of an act . He was a good man who realized The Sword of the Spirit is never meant to chop anybody down.

by: justontime

05-05-2009 @ 5:01pm

The black community is wrong to trust him. Kemp was a sellout. Take off your blinders.

Mr. Kemp announced that he was supporting a mindless plan to expel the children of illegal immigrants from public schools. Up until his reversal, Mr. Kemp had worn as an emblem of courage his rejection of Proposition 187, the 1994 California ballot initiative for closing the schools to immigrant children. In the same interviews, Mr. Kemp revealed that he was ending his opposition to another California ballot initiative that would abolish affirmative-action programs in the state.
http://www.nytimes.com/1996/08/15/opinion/the-j...

You can never trust Republicans. You should know this.

by: BlueDeacon

05-05-2009 @ 5:06pm

Keep in mind, however, that such an "economic boom" had a steep price -- the 'hood became a more bleak place than it had been (and I found that somewhat ironic in this case). Wallis' opposed "supply-side" economics because it just couldn't work for those of lesser means, and we just can't always sweep those philosophical differences aside for the sake of "getting along."

by: BlueDeacon

05-05-2009 @ 5:15pm

To be truthful, Dole also changed a number of his positions when he was running for president, so you can't blame just Kemp for that. Primarily, Dole did not subscribe to "tax-cut" fever when he was in the Senate but signed on to that when he became a Presidential candidate. Let's also remember that this took place 12 years ago, when the political climate was much different.

And besides, who'd have said that Kemp would have kept that position had they been elected? Politicians at that level often make empty promises to win votes that are either at odds with their true positions or they know they can't keep. So, I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt.

by: 1Grace

05-05-2009 @ 5:37pm

Yes this was refreshing . I always liked Jack kemp also . A man of principle , but a man who would listen . He was very concerned in the end because he feared what was happening now was the opposite of what he believed in and has proven to work . But it was easy to see he was concerned for the sake of people , not power .

by: BlueDeacon

05-05-2009 @ 2:17pm

Sadly, even Kemp at times was considered a sellout by his own party, but he demonstrated the possibilities of reaching across the ideological divide to address real problems. There's a reason blacks trusted him -- he actually talked to, not simply at or about, them.

by: xfree9

05-05-2009 @ 2:17pm

Thanks, Jim, for what I observe as a genuine attitude of goodwill toward a man with whom you found disagreement but could validate his life and passions. I hope you continue to think and write about others with whom you disagree in a favorable manner, even if there are points of disagreement.

by: Lord_Voldemort

05-05-2009 @ 6:50pm

Jim,

Speaking as an old Kempie, I appreciate the kind words on behalf of one of my heroes.

LV

by: 1Grace

05-05-2009 @ 3:38pm

Thanks Jim. jack kemp was so glad when Reagan was elected and his beliefs of opportunity for all gave way to one of the biggest economic booms in our history .
He was saddened at the sell out of the many principles you mentioned about recent republican methods in the Bush Administration making compassion sometimes just a word instead of an act . He was a good man who realized The Sword of the Spirit is never meant to chop anybody down.

by: justontime

05-05-2009 @ 5:01pm

The black community is wrong to trust him. Kemp was a sellout. Take off your blinders.

Mr. Kemp announced that he was supporting a mindless plan to expel the children of illegal immigrants from public schools. Up until his reversal, Mr. Kemp had worn as an emblem of courage his rejection of Proposition 187, the 1994 California ballot initiative for closing the schools to immigrant children. In the same interviews, Mr. Kemp revealed that he was ending his opposition to another California ballot initiative that would abolish affirmative-action programs in the state.
http://www.nytimes.com/1996/08/15/opinion/the-j...

You can never trust Republicans. You should know this.

by: BlueDeacon

05-05-2009 @ 5:06pm

Keep in mind, however, that such an "economic boom" had a steep price -- the 'hood became a more bleak place than it had been (and I found that somewhat ironic in this case). Wallis' opposed "supply-side" economics because it just couldn't work for those of lesser means, and we just can't always sweep those philosophical differences aside for the sake of "getting along."

by: BlueDeacon

05-05-2009 @ 5:15pm

To be truthful, Dole also changed a number of his positions when he was running for president, so you can't blame just Kemp for that. Primarily, Dole did not subscribe to "tax-cut" fever when he was in the Senate but signed on to that when he became a Presidential candidate. Let's also remember that this took place 12 years ago, when the political climate was much different.

And besides, who'd have said that Kemp would have kept that position had they been elected? Politicians at that level often make empty promises to win votes that are either at odds with their true positions or they know they can't keep. So, I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt.

by: 1Grace

05-05-2009 @ 5:37pm

Yes this was refreshing . I always liked Jack kemp also . A man of principle , but a man who would listen . He was very concerned in the end because he feared what was happening now was the opposite of what he believed in and has proven to work . But it was easy to see he was concerned for the sake of people , not power .

by: justontime

05-06-2009 @ 1:52pm

The "big fat idiot" Limbaugh would be proud of you defending your Republican friends and their scorched-earth tactics. The vast majority of us are not convinced.

by: BlueDeacon

05-06-2009 @ 2:05pm

Being myself a severe critic of the conservative agenda, I'm sure many of the conservatives who frequent this blog would laugh upon reading that. As I said earlier, Kemp took some heat from true-blue conservatives for even talking to people not like themselves and coming up with real solutions to the urban crisis.

by: Lord_Voldemort

05-05-2009 @ 6:50pm

Jim,

Speaking as an old Kempie, I appreciate the kind words on behalf of one of my heroes.

LV

by: nuclearferret

05-06-2009 @ 2:53pm

Sell-out? Don't try and overlay your own position of the Republican Party today on the party of when Mr. Kemp was actively working. It simply wasn't the case.

by: BlueDeacon

05-06-2009 @ 3:03pm

Their words, not mine.

by: 1Grace

05-06-2009 @ 4:34pm

"Being myself a severe critic of the conservative agenda, I'm sure many of the conservatives who frequent this blog would laugh"

"Sigh" No not laugh... Unfortunatley expected some remarks about a person who recently died and his friendships that did not reach up to soujourner standards of righteousness and truth .
It was looked actually Rick much the same way if Martin Luther King was just struck down , in his case murdered , but death the same . In stead of people speaking of his sincerity to his cause , his life in a special way , some African Americans say Chicago brought in their views he was a sellout , way to peaceful and not forceful enough . Thus opening the gate for statements that followed .

No , no one laughed at your opening statement . Jim Wallis showed some class as he can do .

by: BlueDeacon

05-06-2009 @ 4:58pm

There's a difference, however. King's critics were regionally-based, generally outside the South, because Southerners generally came to understand that, if they wanted to stay alive, "nonviolence" was the way to go. Those voices, including Malcolm X and the Black Panthers, have been consigned to history. You can't yet say the same for Kemp's critics, however.

That said, I share Wallis's views -- I didn't agree with Kemp generally but he was doing some really good things. I was responding to justontime's retort about never trusting Republicans, which I thought was a bit beyond the pale.

by: justontime

05-06-2009 @ 5:16pm

My mistake. When I respond to people I always assume that because they, in their specific comment, refer kindly to one particular Republican/conservative individual or principle that they must adhere to and support every single other Republican/conservative principle or individual. It's an effective way of engaging in conversation, in my mind.

by: justontime

05-06-2009 @ 5:18pm

Republicans and their Rovian tactics are all sell-outs - to corporate interests and neo-con hawks. I'm surprised you didn't ferret that out by now.

by: BlueDeacon

05-06-2009 @ 5:51pm

That's really unfair, however. I for one oppose abortion and gay marriage even while disagreeing with the Republicans on almost everything else.

by: justontime

05-06-2009 @ 1:52pm

The "big fat idiot" Limbaugh would be proud of you defending your Republican friends and their scorched-earth tactics. The vast majority of us are not convinced.

by: BlueDeacon

05-06-2009 @ 2:05pm

Being myself a severe critic of the conservative agenda, I'm sure many of the conservatives who frequent this blog would laugh upon reading that. As I said earlier, Kemp took some heat from true-blue conservatives for even talking to people not like themselves and coming up with real solutions to the urban crisis.

by: nuclearferret

05-06-2009 @ 2:53pm

Sell-out? Don't try and overlay your own position of the Republican Party today on the party of when Mr. Kemp was actively working. It simply wasn't the case.

by: BlueDeacon

05-06-2009 @ 3:03pm

Their words, not mine.

by: jeffp

05-08-2009 @ 4:18pm

If you really wanted to make a strong argument you'd just say "Their words not mine"

Keep posting justontime, I love what your saying

by: 1Grace

05-06-2009 @ 4:34pm

"Being myself a severe critic of the conservative agenda, I'm sure many of the conservatives who frequent this blog would laugh"

"Sigh" No not laugh... Unfortunatley expected some remarks about a person who recently died and his friendships that did not reach up to soujourner standards of righteousness and truth .
It was looked actually Rick much the same way if Martin Luther King was just struck down , in his case murdered , but death the same . In stead of people speaking of his sincerity to his cause , his life in a special way , some African Americans say Chicago brought in their views he was a sellout , way to peaceful and not forceful enough . Thus opening the gate for statements that followed .

No , no one laughed at your opening statement . Jim Wallis showed some class as he can do .

by: BlueDeacon

05-06-2009 @ 4:58pm

There's a difference, however. King's critics were regionally-based, generally outside the South, because Southerners generally came to understand that, if they wanted to stay alive, "nonviolence" was the way to go. Those voices, including Malcolm X and the Black Panthers, have been consigned to history. You can't yet say the same for Kemp's critics, however.

That said, I share Wallis's views -- I didn't agree with Kemp generally but he was doing some really good things. I was responding to justontime's retort about never trusting Republicans, which I thought was a bit beyond the pale.

by: justontime

05-06-2009 @ 5:16pm

My mistake. When I respond to people I always assume that because they, in their specific comment, refer kindly to one particular Republican/conservative individual or principle that they must adhere to and support every single other Republican/conservative principle or individual. It's an effective way of engaging in conversation, in my mind.

by: justontime

05-06-2009 @ 5:18pm

Republicans and their Rovian tactics are all sell-outs - to corporate interests and neo-con hawks. I'm surprised you didn't ferret that out by now.

by: BlueDeacon

05-06-2009 @ 5:51pm

That's really unfair, however. I for one oppose abortion and gay marriage even while disagreeing with the Republicans on almost everything else.

by: justontime

05-07-2009 @ 3:25pm

But it's so much easier to score points in an argument with someone if I can put them in a box and argue against that strawman than against the actual thoughts and writings of another real person.

by: justontime

05-07-2009 @ 3:25pm

But it's so much easier to score points in an argument with someone if I can put them in a box and argue against that strawman than against the actual thoughts and writings of another real person.

by: jeffp

05-08-2009 @ 2:18pm

If you really wanted to make a strong argument you'd just say "Their words not mine"

Keep posting justontime, I love what your saying

by: jeffp

05-08-2009 @ 2:18pm

If you really wanted to make a strong argument you'd just say "Their words not mine"

Keep posting justontime, I love what your saying

Comments sorted by highest rated. After voting you must refresh your page to see the sort order change.

by: BlueDeacon

05-05-2009 @ 2:17pm

Sadly, even Kemp at times was considered a sellout by his own party, but he demonstrated the possibilities of reaching across the ideological divide to address real problems. There's a reason blacks trusted him -- he actually talked to, not simply at or about, them.

by: BlueDeacon

05-05-2009 @ 2:17pm

Sadly, even Kemp at times was considered a sellout by his own party, but he demonstrated the possibilities of reaching across the ideological divide to address real problems. There's a reason blacks trusted him -- he actually talked to, not simply at or about, them.

by: xfree9

05-05-2009 @ 2:17pm

Thanks, Jim, for what I observe as a genuine attitude of goodwill toward a man with whom you found disagreement but could validate his life and passions. I hope you continue to think and write about others with whom you disagree in a favorable manner, even if there are points of disagreement.

by: xfree9

05-05-2009 @ 2:17pm

Thanks, Jim, for what I observe as a genuine attitude of goodwill toward a man with whom you found disagreement but could validate his life and passions. I hope you continue to think and write about others with whom you disagree in a favorable manner, even if there are points of disagreement.

by: 1Grace

05-05-2009 @ 3:38pm

Thanks Jim. jack kemp was so glad when Reagan was elected and his beliefs of opportunity for all gave way to one of the biggest economic booms in our history .
He was saddened at the sell out of the many principles you mentioned about recent republican methods in the Bush Administration making compassion sometimes just a word instead of an act . He was a good man who realized The Sword of the Spirit is never meant to chop anybody down.

by: 1Grace

05-05-2009 @ 3:38pm

Thanks Jim. jack kemp was so glad when Reagan was elected and his beliefs of opportunity for all gave way to one of the biggest economic booms in our history .
He was saddened at the sell out of the many principles you mentioned about recent republican methods in the Bush Administration making compassion sometimes just a word instead of an act . He was a good man who realized The Sword of the Spirit is never meant to chop anybody down.

by: justontime

05-05-2009 @ 5:01pm

The black community is wrong to trust him. Kemp was a sellout. Take off your blinders.

Mr. Kemp announced that he was supporting a mindless plan to expel the children of illegal immigrants from public schools. Up until his reversal, Mr. Kemp had worn as an emblem of courage his rejection of Proposition 187, the 1994 California ballot initiative for closing the schools to immigrant children. In the same interviews, Mr. Kemp revealed that he was ending his opposition to another California ballot initiative that would abolish affirmative-action programs in the state.
http://www.nytimes.com/1996/08/15/opinion/the-j...

You can never trust Republicans. You should know this.

by: justontime

05-05-2009 @ 5:01pm

The black community is wrong to trust him. Kemp was a sellout. Take off your blinders.

Mr. Kemp announced that he was supporting a mindless plan to expel the children of illegal immigrants from public schools. Up until his reversal, Mr. Kemp had worn as an emblem of courage his rejection of Proposition 187, the 1994 California ballot initiative for closing the schools to immigrant children. In the same interviews, Mr. Kemp revealed that he was ending his opposition to another California ballot initiative that would abolish affirmative-action programs in the state.
http://www.nytimes.com/1996/08/15/opinion/the-j...

You can never trust Republicans. You should know this.

by: BlueDeacon

05-05-2009 @ 5:06pm

Keep in mind, however, that such an "economic boom" had a steep price -- the 'hood became a more bleak place than it had been (and I found that somewhat ironic in this case). Wallis' opposed "supply-side" economics because it just couldn't work for those of lesser means, and we just can't always sweep those philosophical differences aside for the sake of "getting along."

by: BlueDeacon

05-05-2009 @ 5:06pm

Keep in mind, however, that such an "economic boom" had a steep price -- the 'hood became a more bleak place than it had been (and I found that somewhat ironic in this case). Wallis' opposed "supply-side" economics because it just couldn't work for those of lesser means, and we just can't always sweep those philosophical differences aside for the sake of "getting along."

by: BlueDeacon

05-05-2009 @ 5:15pm

To be truthful, Dole also changed a number of his positions when he was running for president, so you can't blame just Kemp for that. Primarily, Dole did not subscribe to "tax-cut" fever when he was in the Senate but signed on to that when he became a Presidential candidate. Let's also remember that this took place 12 years ago, when the political climate was much different.

And besides, who'd have said that Kemp would have kept that position had they been elected? Politicians at that level often make empty promises to win votes that are either at odds with their true positions or they know they can't keep. So, I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt.

by: BlueDeacon

05-05-2009 @ 5:15pm

To be truthful, Dole also changed a number of his positions when he was running for president, so you can't blame just Kemp for that. Primarily, Dole did not subscribe to "tax-cut" fever when he was in the Senate but signed on to that when he became a Presidential candidate. Let's also remember that this took place 12 years ago, when the political climate was much different.

And besides, who'd have said that Kemp would have kept that position had they been elected? Politicians at that level often make empty promises to win votes that are either at odds with their true positions or they know they can't keep. So, I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt.

by: 1Grace

05-05-2009 @ 5:37pm

Yes this was refreshing . I always liked Jack kemp also . A man of principle , but a man who would listen . He was very concerned in the end because he feared what was happening now was the opposite of what he believed in and has proven to work . But it was easy to see he was concerned for the sake of people , not power .

by: 1Grace

05-05-2009 @ 5:37pm

Yes this was refreshing . I always liked Jack kemp also . A man of principle , but a man who would listen . He was very concerned in the end because he feared what was happening now was the opposite of what he believed in and has proven to work . But it was easy to see he was concerned for the sake of people , not power .

by: Lord_Voldemort

05-05-2009 @ 6:50pm

Jim,

Speaking as an old Kempie, I appreciate the kind words on behalf of one of my heroes.

LV

by: Lord_Voldemort

05-05-2009 @ 6:50pm

Jim,

Speaking as an old Kempie, I appreciate the kind words on behalf of one of my heroes.

LV

by: justontime

05-06-2009 @ 1:52pm

The "big fat idiot" Limbaugh would be proud of you defending your Republican friends and their scorched-earth tactics. The vast majority of us are not convinced.

by: justontime

05-06-2009 @ 1:52pm

The "big fat idiot" Limbaugh would be proud of you defending your Republican friends and their scorched-earth tactics. The vast majority of us are not convinced.

by: BlueDeacon

05-06-2009 @ 2:05pm

Being myself a severe critic of the conservative agenda, I'm sure many of the conservatives who frequent this blog would laugh upon reading that. As I said earlier, Kemp took some heat from true-blue conservatives for even talking to people not like themselves and coming up with real solutions to the urban crisis.

by: BlueDeacon

05-06-2009 @ 2:05pm

Being myself a severe critic of the conservative agenda, I'm sure many of the conservatives who frequent this blog would laugh upon reading that. As I said earlier, Kemp took some heat from true-blue conservatives for even talking to people not like themselves and coming up with real solutions to the urban crisis.

by: nuclearferret

05-06-2009 @ 2:53pm

Sell-out? Don't try and overlay your own position of the Republican Party today on the party of when Mr. Kemp was actively working. It simply wasn't the case.

by: nuclearferret

05-06-2009 @ 2:53pm

Sell-out? Don't try and overlay your own position of the Republican Party today on the party of when Mr. Kemp was actively working. It simply wasn't the case.

by: BlueDeacon

05-06-2009 @ 3:03pm

Their words, not mine.

by: BlueDeacon

05-06-2009 @ 3:03pm

Their words, not mine.

by: 1Grace

05-06-2009 @ 4:34pm

"Being myself a severe critic of the conservative agenda, I'm sure many of the conservatives who frequent this blog would laugh"

"Sigh" No not laugh... Unfortunatley expected some remarks about a person who recently died and his friendships that did not reach up to soujourner standards of righteousness and truth .
It was looked actually Rick much the same way if Martin Luther King was just struck down , in his case murdered , but death the same . In stead of people speaking of his sincerity to his cause , his life in a special way , some African Americans say Chicago brought in their views he was a sellout , way to peaceful and not forceful enough . Thus opening the gate for statements that followed .

No , no one laughed at your opening statement . Jim Wallis showed some class as he can do .

by: 1Grace

05-06-2009 @ 4:34pm

"Being myself a severe critic of the conservative agenda, I'm sure many of the conservatives who frequent this blog would laugh"

"Sigh" No not laugh... Unfortunatley expected some remarks about a person who recently died and his friendships that did not reach up to soujourner standards of righteousness and truth .
It was looked actually Rick much the same way if Martin Luther King was just struck down , in his case murdered , but death the same . In stead of people speaking of his sincerity to his cause , his life in a special way , some African Americans say Chicago brought in their views he was a sellout , way to peaceful and not forceful enough . Thus opening the gate for statements that followed .

No , no one laughed at your opening statement . Jim Wallis showed some class as he can do .

by: BlueDeacon

05-06-2009 @ 4:58pm

There's a difference, however. King's critics were regionally-based, generally outside the South, because Southerners generally came to understand that, if they wanted to stay alive, "nonviolence" was the way to go. Those voices, including Malcolm X and the Black Panthers, have been consigned to history. You can't yet say the same for Kemp's critics, however.

That said, I share Wallis's views -- I didn't agree with Kemp generally but he was doing some really good things. I was responding to justontime's retort about never trusting Republicans, which I thought was a bit beyond the pale.

by: BlueDeacon

05-06-2009 @ 4:58pm

There's a difference, however. King's critics were regionally-based, generally outside the South, because Southerners generally came to understand that, if they wanted to stay alive, "nonviolence" was the way to go. Those voices, including Malcolm X and the Black Panthers, have been consigned to history. You can't yet say the same for Kemp's critics, however.

That said, I share Wallis's views -- I didn't agree with Kemp generally but he was doing some really good things. I was responding to justontime's retort about never trusting Republicans, which I thought was a bit beyond the pale.

by: justontime

05-06-2009 @ 5:16pm

My mistake. When I respond to people I always assume that because they, in their specific comment, refer kindly to one particular Republican/conservative individual or principle that they must adhere to and support every single other Republican/conservative principle or individual. It's an effective way of engaging in conversation, in my mind.

by: justontime

05-06-2009 @ 5:16pm

My mistake. When I respond to people I always assume that because they, in their specific comment, refer kindly to one particular Republican/conservative individual or principle that they must adhere to and support every single other Republican/conservative principle or individual. It's an effective way of engaging in conversation, in my mind.

by: justontime

05-06-2009 @ 5:18pm

Republicans and their Rovian tactics are all sell-outs - to corporate interests and neo-con hawks. I'm surprised you didn't ferret that out by now.

by: justontime

05-06-2009 @ 5:18pm

Republicans and their Rovian tactics are all sell-outs - to corporate interests and neo-con hawks. I'm surprised you didn't ferret that out by now.

by: BlueDeacon

05-06-2009 @ 5:51pm

That's really unfair, however. I for one oppose abortion and gay marriage even while disagreeing with the Republicans on almost everything else.

by: BlueDeacon

05-06-2009 @ 5:51pm

That's really unfair, however. I for one oppose abortion and gay marriage even while disagreeing with the Republicans on almost everything else.

by: justontime

05-07-2009 @ 3:25pm

But it's so much easier to score points in an argument with someone if I can put them in a box and argue against that strawman than against the actual thoughts and writings of another real person.

by: justontime

05-07-2009 @ 3:25pm

But it's so much easier to score points in an argument with someone if I can put them in a box and argue against that strawman than against the actual thoughts and writings of another real person.

by: jeffp

05-08-2009 @ 2:18pm

If you really wanted to make a strong argument you'd just say "Their words not mine"

Keep posting justontime, I love what your saying

by: jeffp

05-08-2009 @ 2:18pm

If you really wanted to make a strong argument you'd just say "Their words not mine"

Keep posting justontime, I love what your saying

by: jeffp

05-08-2009 @ 4:18pm

If you really wanted to make a strong argument you'd just say "Their words not mine"

Keep posting justontime, I love what your saying

by: jeffp

05-08-2009 @ 4:18pm

If you really wanted to make a strong argument you'd just say "Their words not mine"

Keep posting justontime, I love what your saying