Video: 'Jesus Camp' Kids Pray for President Obama

the selection of scriptures is in poor taste and the idea of a cardboard cutout to represent the president is a little strange, intercession never needs a physical representation.
my initial thought was that it looks like, and is treated as, a graven image.
unfortunately, I think this video has strengthened the stereotypes.

As someone who became a Christian in a similar type of "denomination" or approach to faith, this looks completely normal to me. I can understand how it might be misinterpreted by those not familiar with these practices. But laying on of hands has always been done to pray FOR the person, not TO the person, and just listening to the words these kids use in their prayers should clear up any misconceptions.

Also, it was not unusual for someone to stand in as a proxy for someone that was not present in this approach to intercession. It is a little odd to use a cardboard cutout, but they are following that principle. I don't know if it Biblical or not, but somehow I really don't think God cares in this case.

What specifically about the selection of scriptures is in poor taste?

Laying on of hands is for the ordination of someone. Or the receiving of the Spirit. Whatever the reason, hands are always laid on a willing participant (and in most cases someone of your fold). I can't judge if God cares, but any practice or sacrament that deviates from what is described in the Bible should be questioned.

Generally any scripture that describes Obama as a King is out of context. The King the scriptures are referring to is someone with absolute power (like a TRUE dictator) and has the ability to move an entire nation on a whim. It would be better to pray for your Congressmen and then for Congress since they have more power than the president.

The specific scriptures are 2 Thes 3:3 " the evil one." The evil one is Satan, or anyone willfully (i.e. not unknowingly) doing Satan's work.
Ex 23:7 "do not kill the innocent." obviously a slight at his pro-choice record. Obama is prochoice not proabortion there's a big difference. but at any rate, these scriptures are a direct attack on his character.

what a lot of hullabaloo about nothing... let one eat meat offered to idols (or lay hands on a cardboard cutout if they need one) and let another eat only vegetables (if the cardboard cutout offends them, don't participate). let each one be convinced/convicted in his own mind...

Amen Irish. I'm so tired of Christians looking at other Christians doing something God commanded (such as praying for our leaders) and denouncing them because of some small differences in method.

I think they it depends on your perspective. "Do not kill the innocent" can also refer to civilians killed in war, which is how I took the scripture in this context (I'd have to watch it again, but I seem to remember they were praying about war at that point).

We're called to pray for all those in government. The scripture says "for kings and all those who are in authority." Certainly the President counts as one in authority. The argument that Obama isn't a king should not be used as an excuse not to pray for him.

At the time Psalms was written, kings were the dominant style of leadership. Had David been living under a democracy, I'm sure he would have referred to his leader as a president, not a king.

The point is, and I think you are missing this, these kids are fervently praying for our president. Why is the "how" of their prayers such an issue? We can certainly get hung up in the legalism and the "how", but it seems like trifling over trivialities. Again, the point is, these young people are praying for our president.

Myself, I'm encouraged by their fervent prayer for the leader of this nation, and I'm not going to judge how they do it. I'm encouraged by their heart for our president, not whether they pray in some "correct" manner. I"m just glad they are doing it.

This video is in stark contrast with the "Letter from a 4th Grade Teacher" to Obama that is being circulated around the web. It is a hate-filled, angry, disrespectful piece that does anything but show the love of Christ. With that as a background, I found this video a welcome breath of fresh air.

In the "Jesus Camp" movie, the children seemed to give the hand salute to George W. Bush in the same way that the youth of Nazi Germany saluted Hitler.

It actually looked like the kids at the camp were worshipping G.W. Bush.

Most of the children in the documentary were homeschooled and their parents used history textbooks written by authors who revised the actual history of the USA.

The analogy seems to be a bit of a stretch and can be used to justify anything, but there's a difference between superstition and the new testament's description of intercession and how the assembly gathers.

More importantly, if the intent is to communicate to the "uninformed people in the media" then that analogy can't work since the media isn't in the Lord and subject to Paul's instruction. If you can win a soul by praying for the president and not a cardboard cutout (for the sake of the media) , do it.

I suggest that you folks do some research on Becky Fisher and her "Kids in Ministry International" programs. She was a children's pastor in a Word of Faith doctrine church for a while. Most Word of Faith churches have a connection with Kenneth Hagins' Rhema Church and Rhema Bible Training Center in Broken Arrow, Oklahoma.

Yes, I agree there are problems with that---but what does that have to do with them praying for the president?

What is the issue here? What message should we take away from this video? That they aren't praying right? Or that they are doing something we all should be doing?

"but there's a difference between superstition and the new testament's description of intercession and how the assembly gathers."

And there's a difference between obeying the letter of the law and obeying the spirit of the law.

yet didn't paul state, "ALL things are lawful?" therefore, there is no need to 'justify' or condemn another's behavior... only the need to mind our own business and not judge Another's servant. no one answers to 'man whose breath is in his nostrils'. selah.

I have some kind of problem when I attempt to watch a YouTube video embedded in a non-YouTube website. The screen goes black and I only hear the audio. I don't have a problem with the videos on the YouTube website.

There is nothing wrong with praying for whomever is the President of the USA at the time you pray. It is necessary that every Believer in Jesus in the USA do that often.

But, apparently no one has ever taught the children who are involved with Becky Fisher's ministry how to pray.

When you pray for a person, you are supposed to talk to the Lord Jesus like you talk to an older brother when you are asking him for something and he doesn't make you beg for it. And, you don't have to say the same thing over and over when you pray for someone or just say any other kind of prayer.

The point is, they are praying. I don't see how the "how" matters.

Ironically, I'm someone who came out of that kind of spiritual background, and so I have my share of issues with it. So, here I am defending their praying.

I don't think we need to be judging each other on how we pray. I have learned that people pray in the way they relate to God according to how God created them. There are, in fact, a myriad ways of relating to God, and I would say there as many ways as there are people. The important thing is THAT they are praying, now HOW they are praying. And the how is often based on one's spiritual tradition.

Also ironically, when I was steeped in that type of spiritual community, I was judgmental of others who prayed differently--quietly, or with written prayers. So, although I have since learned that the charismatic approach is not how I naturally relate to God, I'm not going to look down my nose at those who pray that way. Nor will I judge any for their way of relating to God.

While O'Brien's church now has its own Christian School, apparently his son, Levi, was being homeschooled in the movie.

I did check out the church's website and also read the Statement of Faith. I don't have any conflict with that.

I have a vision problem and I didn't see that this video was at Tim Obrien's church itself.

But, the way that the children prayed in the video is very much like the children in the "Jesus Camp" Movie prayed.

Most of the Charismatic churches today have as a part of their history the Charismatic movement of the latter 1950s and early 1960s. Don't confuse classical Pentecostal denominations with Charismatic churches. Most of the latter came out of non-Pentecostal churches.

I do ask this question: Why did they put this on YouTube in the 1st place?

Your missing my point. What you say above should not in any way be an excuse to denigrate the prayers of these young people.

Well, I supposed they are praying the very same way that their elders in the church pray.

I do have experience in attending actual Pentecostal churches and Charismatic ones. I have heard many people pray and at the beginning of every sentence in a long prayer, they said "Father God."

As in the example which Jesus gave to pray, "Father" only needs to be used once and according to Jesus' own words, when you pray, your prayers go through him.

I haven't been able to attend church services in a while by I am Pentecostal by experience.

You need to finish Paul's thought "..but not all things edify." (more specifically he keeps saying you can eat whatever you want.)

Ironically, if you study Corinthians closely, you just quoted the saying that Paul keeps throwing in their face. Paul was making fun of them for flaunting their "freedom", kinda like the way you are flaunting it.
His point is not to go about life in arrogance, but in respect of others.

I've always thought the constant repetition of "God" or "Lord" had the same function as the word "um" in speech. It's not really a conscious insertion, but an unconscious insertion. Many people probably don't even realize they do it, much as most people giving speeches don't realize they are inserting "um" at every pause. At least that was why I would do it while praying aloud.

It's not easy, at least not for me, as an introvert, to pray in front of people. Usually I'm spending the whole time thinking of what to pray, and the last thing I'm thinking of is whether or not I'm inserting "God" between every sentence.

So prayer doesn't edify?

Would you prefer these kids didn't pray for Obama at all? You seem to be saying, "pray the right way, or don't pray at all." Is that what you mean to say?

No, I am saying: Not all behaviour edifies, though said behavour may (possibly) be lawful.

It would be well to look at Mathew 6:5-15 for Jesus' instruction on prayer. This is not "rules". I'm not saying there are specific "rules" to prayer, but Jesus gives explicit instruction. This video shows "praying..so that people can see them" and "babbling repetitiously".
How does this build up the church? How does this witness to the lost?
If this was a stunt to reverse the "Jesus Camp" video, why make it look like the same video with a different cut out?
Why not pray for people with more power than the president, like Congress or The Supreme Court?

I too came out of a charismatic fellowship and began seeing how loosely we held theology and sound doctrine and I regret passing that on to people I witnessed to and fellowshipped with.

It builds up the church because this week I got the "Letter from a 4th Grade Teacher" from a fellow Christian (I described it in an earlier post). I'm appalled that my fellow Christian thinks that woman's words were in any way Christ-like. So I sent him this video in hopes that he would see what we, as Christians, are called to do for our leaders.

I don't see this as a video that is a witness to the world, but rather a witness to our fellow Christians. Many of my own Christian friends are very negative towards Obama and have bought into the hateful rhetoric that has been leveled towards him. It builds the church because it reminds us that we are called to pray for our leaders whether we agree with them or not.

The point that this is "so that people can see them" is a bit concerning. I would have preferred it had been posted to the Christian version of YouTube (can't remember what it is called), as you are right--it invites ridicule from those who don't understand. This to me seems more a matter for Christians rather than non-Christians and more a convicting video for those who have been less than respectful or Christlike to our president.

"Why not pray for people with more power than the president, like Congress or The Supreme Court?"

Because we are called to pray for ALL in authority. We are not called to pray only for those who have the most authority.

They aren't babbling repetitiously. They aren't repeating the same prayer over and over. You're beef concerns style, not substance. Jesus was concerned about substance, not style. Having been in circles that pray that way and having prayed that way myself, I know that repeating "Lord" like that is an unconscious habit, and that's all. It's not what Jesus meant when he spoke of vain repetitions.

I didn't see it as a stunt because I'm not familiar with the other video, thus I guess I am less inclined to read such motives into this video.

I agree with your last point, and I too carry a lot of baggage from that experience. But having judged others for how they pray has too often blinded me to the heart behind the prayer, and I'm not going to turn around and do it to the people who are still in the Christian circles I came out of. It's tempting to do so, but I remember their hearts, even if I don't agree with the style of prayer.

Put yourself in the kid's shoes--I was one of those kids once, and I know when I prayed like that I felt like I was storming the gates of Heaven. I would be absolutely crushed if someone who doesn't even know me were to question my motives or say my prayer doesn't count because of how I was praying. If it were me, and I heard that criticism, I probably would have stopped praying aloud, given my introverted and self-conscious nature. How would you feel if you knew you stifled someone's prayer life or passion for the Lord in that way? Kids self-impressions are very fragile--be careful in your passion for what is "right" you don't crush the budding spirit within them.