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Glenn Beck's Faulty Logic

I do not usually watch Glenn Beck's program. So many books, so little time. However, on April 6, while working on another project, my intuitive mind told me to watch Glenn Beck. So, I did. Half of the program was already over. When I joined the program, Beck was saying that President Obama was an intelligent man who chose to surround himself with Marxists. He referred to Rev. Jeremiah Wright. (I know Rev. Wright, and he is a social justice preacher/teacher from within the tradition of Black liberation theology and not the caricature that the media portrayed during the presidential campaign.) Beck played a sound bite of Rev. Jim Wallis talking about redistribution of wealth.

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Beck also referred to two other former White House aides in the Obama administration to make his case that Obama was a Marxist not to be compared with James Madison.

I do not spend time on Beck because his logic is usually fallacious. In this instance his bad logic walked hand in hand with an ignorance of the U.S. Constitution. And all of this was conflated with a question about whether the government could do anything better than the private sector and a lamentation about the federal budget deficit.

Beck's logical error is where he thinks that if someone uses a term such as social justice or redistribution of wealth that this makes her the same as every other person or organization that uses the term. Such logic would say that because Marx's statement: "From each according to his abilities, to each according to his needs" is similar to the Christian text Acts 2: 44-45: "And all who believed were together and had all things in common; and they sold their possessions and goods and distributed them to all, as any had need," therefore Marx is a Christian. Marx was not a Christian.

Further, if Beck's problem with President Obama is that he will expand government and lay a heavy tax burden on the nation in the name of redistribution of wealth, this is no problem at all. According to the Constitution, taxation is not a presidential power. The legislature holds this power, specifically the House of Representatives. The founders, concerned with taxation without representation, wanted the power of the purse to reside with the chamber that answered directly to the people every two years. Thus, Beck's complaint is with the 535 members of Congress -- not with President Obama, his present or former appointees, nor with his spiritual mentors.

When we think about redistribution of wealth, it is important to remember that the redistribution in this country is from the young to the old. It reflects our societal values and obligations.

Personally, I am happy to have a president who seeks advice from people of faith. Our religious traditions help to lay the moral foundation upon which our laws ought to rest. A logic of love that Jesus lived and taught is the day star that ought to guide our personal, societal, economic, and political decision-making.

Dr. Valerie Elverton Dixon is an independent scholar who publishes lectures and essays at JustPeaceTheory.com. She received her Ph.D. in religion and society from Temple University and taught Christian ethics at United Theological Seminary and Andover Newton Theological School.

Sojourners relies on the support of readers like you to sustain our message and ministry.

by: stljoie

04-08-2010 @ 3:31am

Jesus said "render unto Caesar what is Caesar's" ie" the government".
He also turned over the tables of gold in the house of worship. He also called on followers to leave behind homes and families and follow him. He also said "it is harder for a rich man to enter heaven than for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle". He also said " Do unto others as you would have them do unto you". When you lose your job, as I did, you will rejoice over the healthcare.

by: Dadofiandi

04-09-2010 @ 5:24pm

I saw this on Yahoo an example of social justice which I believe is privately funded but not 100% sure on that, but I thought you might find it encouraging, regarding kids who don't want to be educated.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/csm/20100408/ts_csm/292210;_ylt=AufENqA9VcH9MH1Q...

by: Jonahn

04-08-2010 @ 2:37am

yes, social upward mobility, as I said. Its hard to get out to the burbs if i dont have a car, if i dont have a drivers license, if i dont have money for gas, insurance, payments....

by: Jonahn

04-09-2010 @ 4:31am

You think I'm a woman because why?....

by: youse

04-09-2010 @ 5:07pm

Conditioning Glenn Beck is a Mormon, Jim Wallis is a leftist Liberal. Niether represent God. President Obama IS, by his proclamations and actions a Socialist at best and a Marxist at worst. Jeremiah Write is a hateful, obnoxious man and certainly does not represent Jesus Christ. The kingdom of God serves Jesus Christ. We are a new creation. It grives the Holy Spirit when those that tell the world they too are Christians, yet represent their own wickedness, refusing to bow. Jesus calls these tares. Fellow brothers and sisters in Christ, separate yourselves from this false doctrine. Preach the good news of Jesus Christ to the unsaved, "For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which GOD prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them." Jesus Christ is our Lord, not man. The concept of Social Justice belongs to man, not God. God is comapssionate and loving and caring and His Holy Spirit dictates how we treat others, not man. "For the kingdom of God does not consist in talk but in power." The kingdom of God is not in man's wisdom, but in wisdom that comes from God. "The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom, and the knowledge of the Holy One is insight."

by: Jonahn

04-09-2010 @ 4:10am

The focus on the individual in relation to Christianity in America is a fascinating topic. There has been some pretty good literature written on it. Individualism is rather foreign to the Bible, it is almost purely a western construction. I recently had a conversation with a friend about orthodoxy vs orthopraxy, orthodoxy focusing on right belief and orthopraxy on right practice. The focus on right belief resulted in divisions within the church and has led to the religion of individualism that has hijacked Christianity and the message of Jesus.

by: Dadofiandi

04-09-2010 @ 4:51pm

Yeah the Declaration of Independence was written in what 1776, the Civil War ended in 1865, the Civil Right movement, end of Jim Crow laws, end of segregation happened about a 100yrs later as did women's sufferage. Labor laws, child labor laws all unnecessary. Nothing to see here.

by: Jonahn

04-09-2010 @ 4:03am

I was just actually talking to a friend of mine tonight about this. What is the best way to share opinions? What is the best way to disagree? What is the best way to provide alternative perspectives? What makes these things challenging is that people are so easy to become defensive. Our "dialogues" are no longer about conversing and sharing as much as they are trying to prove the other wrong. And actually, it seems to me that the more people argue, the more solidified in their ideologies they become. So is there a point to arguing and debating. Yes, but some forums are more conducive to this than others. In fact, one of the reasons I enjoy commenting on this blog is because it allows me to write out and articulate my thoughts that I might not do otherwise. I also enjoy reading comments from other posters that are willing to ask questions and be challenged. I don't really think that my words here will change minds. In a selfish way, I like to write out my arguments for my own understanding, and to encourage people who may think more similarly to me. So, I guess I'm not really trying to reason with the unreasonable, I am trying my best to sustain reason for those who still choose to pursue it.

by: scat

04-11-2010 @ 1:48am

"Try this for a thought experiment: there are a lot of non-Christians walking around who think the Golden Rule is one of the soundest moral ideas ever. Does that make them Christians?ype your comment here."

We are too quick to pin labels on people.We call comone a Republican, a Marxist, a Christian, etc as if that is all we hav e to know ab out a person and then we judge them on that basis. We all do it, but the right has tu;rned it into an art form.

Until recently I consdierted myself blessed to have two very good friends from childhood still in my life. One is a shining example of living as Christ would have us live -- always there for a friend, kind to all, generous to a fault, etc. To my mind this is what it means to "believe" in Christ, more so than saying you believe He was the Son of God. After all, even Satan is said to believe that.
The other friend attends church several times a week, regularly quotes scripture, is outgoing and freindly to all, beleives liberals and Democrats are evil, shuns anyone who is "different", fears the Muslims are taking over the country and believes everything that comes from the right.
Theologically, I don't know which one is the better "Christian" and thankfully it's not my job to judge that. But I do know which one reflects the love of God and which one is the true friend.

by: duhsciple

04-08-2010 @ 7:12pm

Obviously it should be somebody else :)

by: Dadofiandi

04-09-2010 @ 4:43pm

"But do not lose your own soul in the process ....otherwise you will find yourself condoning and blaming and enabling and helping to perpetuate the victim mentality. Try this for a few years and, in the end, if you have been able to help, say, 5 kids to get out of that mind trap and pull out of the depraved system of failure that perpetuates poverty all in the name of Social Justice. "
I am confused are you angry at the people, the system or both? Social Justice doesn't start with welfare via the government nor does it end there. Social justice isn't meant to be paternalistic, but people like you on the front line trying to change peoples mindsets or assiting those who wish to climb out of the crab bucket. Many of the people you talk about feel like they are victims, which they are no doubt to the government welfare (which I think you suggest), their parents or peer mentalities, other peoples conceptions, etc. I don't believe anyone here is suggesting throwing entitlements to people is the solution. My wife's family was on food stamps for a time when she was a child, it served its purpose by helping them meet ends. Was that wrong? I think you helping 5 people is awesome. Everyone who met Jesus didn't change their ways so don't feel too bad.

by: BlueDeacon

04-09-2010 @ 4:02am

That's plain wrong -- because, as a pastor pointed out, Jesus never told anyone to "get saved"; rather, He said, "Follow me." And especially in that culture, the focus was on the community, not the individual.

by: John Clark

04-08-2010 @ 7:02pm

I would gladly pay 10% in taxes then the almost 30% that I am paying now.

by: prgrs_ev

04-09-2010 @ 3:57am

Take a sociology class, visit a homeless shelter in a large urban area, volunteer in soup kitchem, spend some time with the Salvation Army, visit an Indian reservation, talk with some folks in your community that have grey hair that have been buffeted by life; discover first hand for yourself.

by: Tocqueville

04-22-2010 @ 3:52am

"

by: John Clark

04-08-2010 @ 6:59pm

We went over this tax thing in another post.

by: Conditioning

04-09-2010 @ 5:34pm

Tocqueville: "And what do you think the fullfilment of the Kingdom of Heavan is? Biblically, please."

That is the question. The Kingdom of Heaven resists being defined in plain speech. With the help of parables and Bible passages loaded with symbolic and abstract language, I will try to make my answer coherent.

From Matthew 13:45-46: The kingdom of heaven is like a merchant in search of fine pearls; on finding one pearl of great value, he went and sold all the he had and bought it.

We experience the fulfillment of the Kingdom when we do what the merchant did; he sacrificed everything for the Kingdom that is within/among us, as read in Luke 17:20-21: Now when He was asked by the Pharisees when the kingdom of God would come, He answered them and said, "The kingdom of God does not come with observation; nor will they say, 'See here!' or 'See there!' For indeed, the kingdom of God is within[a] you."
[a] Or among

The Kingdom is fulfilled through faith, hope, and -- most of all -- love, as discussed in 1 Corinthians 13. Love is without a doubt the greatest commandment (Mark 12:27-29). We can love by following the guidance of Matthew 25, and the by acting like the Samaritan in Luke 10:25-37. And we must love our enemies (Matthew 5:44).

For more parables about the Kingdom and how its fulfilled see Matthew 13.

by: Jonahn

04-09-2010 @ 3:52am

yes, thats the one. sorry for the bad link. Thanks for the referrals, I will check them out.

by: John Clark

04-08-2010 @ 6:58pm

Economic justice... what does that mean??

by: prgrs_ev

04-09-2010 @ 3:43am

We have companies also that are importing workers in the IT field because they can pay them less than their domestic competition...

by: kcrothers

04-11-2010 @ 2:38am

"I believe the Bible is the word of God and it has all the answers to any challenge that we may have in our life."

My wireless router doesn't seem to be working. What chapter and verse would you recommend?

by: John Clark

04-08-2010 @ 6:51pm

Yes, I have considered this but when I see examples of people who are in this same situation get it done, then I look at your example as an excuse.

by: prgrs_ev

04-09-2010 @ 3:38am

Sounds pretty clear to me.

by: BlueDeacon

04-13-2010 @ 6:48pm

Interesting

by: pawheel

04-08-2010 @ 6:49pm

Funny, last week was the first week I chose to actually watch Beck instead of getting what Glenn says from reading what others say he said. The episode Valerie saw I saw also, as well as a couple of others I have watched. One of them was a question and answer session with some of his believers (pardon the term). I found him to not be a raving Republican as Alternet paints him because he seems to dislike both parties, but favors the Repubs over the Dems. I still disagree with most of what he says, but he was arguing the other night about the fact that many liberals want Fox off the air. He has a point that freedom of speech also allows for the (almost as) one sided MSNBC, even though I enjoy Rachel Maddows show. We have to have guys like him because of our freedom of speech.
No, I'm not joining the Tea Party, I'll stick with the Green Party. I just think we should listen outside our comfort zone more often.

by: SALLYFARRAR

04-09-2010 @ 5:54pm

IMHO, this current welfare system is so seriously flawed it is now at the point that it hurts, no cripples, the very ones that it is intended to help.
The problems within it are so embedded and so systemic that it is difficult to even begin to objectively study it. IMHO, to start with, the government needs to say No the number of out of wedlock children it is willing to support. I would guess that most of the people who subscribe to this blog have some sort of an idea of what it takes to successfully raise a child and you all know that it takes more than just a young girl with some cash in her pocket. My husband and I raised two children together, shoulder to shoulder, working diligently and hard to get them properly fed, clothed, educated, spiritually nourished, disciplined and released into society as civilized young adults. It was rough under the best of circumstances. How on earth a teenage girl can think she can take on the proper care and raising of a child with no father in sight nor even a grandfather is crazy. You can go into WalMart late at night and see these bands of teenage girls roaming around dragging around their infants and toddlers with no more concern than if they were puppies. The babies are screaming and crying and exhausted because they are being raised by children whose own teenage mothers had no dreaming idea how to raise a child. The basic needs of a child are never met when the mother is a mere child whose own needs were never met. I can't even talk about it. Let me say this: Nobody knows the trouble I've seen. You don't learn these troubles in a sociology class or by "visiting" a homeless shelter. You will NEVER learn about this stuff and its realities in any college course. You learn about it by getting out there and trying to help.

by: John Clark

04-19-2010 @ 6:19pm

Ley,

As Jesus being God's son, he knows all the answers.

As far as my goal for financial prosperity, I believe when I use my talents to help others achieve their goals, I should be rewarded in order to satisfy my desires.

I also understand that I can help more people with more financial resources then without.

I believe God wants everyone to use their talents and abilities to help others. And I believe the more people you help, the more you will be able to realize your desires.

I believe that Jesus did not speak in terms of finances because that comes as a by product of serving others. But he did consistently talk about "individual" responsibility. I have never read in the bible a statement that calls for a group or something outside of the individual to change in order for the individual to be happy or fulfilled.

And last but not least...

I believe that we must do everything for God's glory.

God Bless You

by: Ngchen

04-08-2010 @ 6:39pm

Chrispycritter1 wrote:
...Call me an Ideologue, but we as Christians are called to change the world. We do not need government, we need to be loving people as we were told to do (with action)...

But could it be that some aspects of changing the world DO require government action? Things like building complete streets, ending segregation, and so on?

by: John Clark

04-19-2010 @ 6:00pm

People who use their God Given talents to help others are covered in great detail in the Bible. Both Rich and Poor.

The rich people covered in the Bible were able to effect more then those in their immediate presence.

"Draw nigh to God, and he will draw nigh to you." James 4:8

"Ask and it will be given to you; seek and you will find; knock and the door will be opened to you." Matthew 7:6-8

"For as he thinketh in his heart, so is he." Proverbs 23:7

There are many examples of the law of attraction in the bible.

God Bless You

by: Ngchen

04-08-2010 @ 6:38pm

How often does the event you describe occur (the guy who sired 40 kids and cares for none of them)? But yes, it's very true that certain segments of society are in the dumps from their own doings. Ultimately, as the saying goes, we can lead horses to water but we can't make them drink.

by: ley6224

04-19-2010 @ 5:56pm

Last but not least, one point you did not respond to: did Jesus just not know your secret to being rich? I never heard of him trying to accumulate wealth. How do you reconcile this with your own stated goal of financial prosperity? Do you believe that God wants everyone to be financial prosperous? And if so why did Jesus not focus a speck of his attention or words on financial prosperity?

by: Ngchen

04-08-2010 @ 6:33pm

Problem with $100,000 chemotherapy is in the $100,000. Government heavily regulates and pretty much has regulated health-care since the literal snake-oil salesmen days of the late 19th century. I agree with the regulation, BTW. But the problem lies with the $100,000 - ultimately somebody has to pay it, unless we come up with a way to slash the bill. Should that somebody be the church, government (aka everybody), or someone else?

by: ley6224

04-19-2010 @ 5:49pm

"I got into a good debate on a Christian website...all of their rebuttals never mentioned personal responsibility or the need for anyone to change the way they think or act."

This is untrue. I do believe that individuals need to take personal responsibility and I do believe we need systemic change as well. So by saying that no one on this site believes in personal responsibility or that anyone needs to change his behaviors and habits, you are mischaracterizing at least me, if no one else.

You said "A" about everyone on this site, and for me, "A" is untrue, and I am a person on this site, and therefore you mischaracterized me to fit your own purposes.

This is dishonest and irresponsible. Again, I ask you to consider your own behavior before judging others (the plank in your own eye before the speck in mine!).

Also, I look forward to hearing your biblical-based response to my questions below.

by: Ngchen

04-08-2010 @ 6:30pm

Just because some people overcame near impossible odds, doesn't mean that those odds were ever fair or just. Now, I understand how as a society we must structure ourselves in such a way to minimize the temptation to be a freeloader, and to reward work and punish laziness (humans are all naturally lazy.) But striving for a more just society can include (but not be limited to) economic justice.

by: Conditioning

04-09-2010 @ 6:12pm

I suspect plenty of people have "known the trouble" you've seen. Besides, we can all empathize.

Welfare does enable some, it is far perfect. But we shouldn't we toss the baby out with the bath water. Yes, the "system" needs to be reformed, and we do that without starting from scratch. The legal system is similarly tainted, should we get rid of law until we can come up with something better?

Helping is the point, and we aren't going to have fresh start with welfare, so we should do what we can to fix it.

by: ley6224

04-19-2010 @ 5:39pm

Ok Tocque, I will attempt to answer your questions from the point of view of Jesus-follower and an advocate of social justice, although I cannot speak for anyone else.

From my point of view, it's pretty simple:

I do not think anyone should give up their privileges or rights.

If by "revoking privileges" you mean paying taxes, well, I don't consider paying taxes to be a revokation of privilege. In fact, in return paying taxes, we - every single American - receives a host of services: roads, schools, post offices, highways, access police, fire fighters, teachers, school books,, parks, beautiful state parks and lakes, boat ramps, the protection of armed forces, public pools, community centers, libraries, computer and internet use, and then things like medicare and s.s. benefits eventually.

Again, if by privilege you are getting at the fact the Americans are "forced" to pay taxes, then I say to you that I do not consider paying taxes a revocation of my privileges, I consider it my part of the social contract that makes our democracy work, my contribution to a better community and country, and my exchange for the plethora of benefits I receive in return.

I hope this sufficiently answers your questions.

by: Ngchen

04-08-2010 @ 6:27pm

John Clark wrote:
...I am looking for where it says in the Bible it is ok to take money from one through a government and give to another.

I think in the Bible this would fall under the ten commandments namely "Thou shalt not steal".

So is it your contention that ALL taxes are theft? If not, then why are some government expenditures A-OK, and some not?

by: BlueDeacon

04-09-2010 @ 6:09pm

Do you understand why the welfare program was started in the first place? Because at that time many men were abandoning their families due to their inability to find decent-paying work; in many cases (especially in the African-American community), it was easier for his wife to find a job, often as a domestic, and that strained marriages often to the breaking point. Repeat millions of times over and fast-forward a couple of generations and you see the problem: The father didn't have the authority to lead the family properly, couldn't raise his sons to become productive men and also couldn't cover his daughters to keep them out of the clutches of leches. With all the bellyaching about welfare, I haven't seen to many on the right address these issues.

by: John Clark

04-19-2010 @ 5:28pm

Ley,

As I have not mischaracterized anyone on this site, I am offended by your comments.

But I do love mine enemies, so I forgive you even you have trespassed against me.

I can't agree with you more with this statement: "Personal responsibility starts with yourself" as it does for everyone one on this site.

All I here on this site is why everyone is held back by the man! And that they can't get no where until things "outside" of themselves changes. That is not personal responsibility... that is an excuse.

God Bless You

by: BlueDeacon

04-14-2010 @ 7:57pm

Yeah.

It seems to me that, if folks are serious about doing something for the least of these, they would work to give them the same kind of opportunities that they had. However, the idea of "equality" seems to give such people a coronary because they know it will cost them something (and I'm not just talking money, either). There's a reason why Beck went after ACORN -- for years it had been involved in the process -- and it's always been true that folks mobilizing for the sake of empowerment represent a major threat to the status quo.

by: ley6224

04-19-2010 @ 5:24pm

In case what I just wrote was not clear, I'd like to know where the Law of Attraction is mentioned in the Bible. Is that "law" mentioned more than the poor are mentioned? Are wealthy people mentioned in a positive light more than poor people are mentioned in a positive light in the Bible? Are you using the Bible to justify your accumulation of wealth? Have you twisted the Bible to justify your 21st Century American consumerism? These are legitimate questions I ask, not accusations.

by: BlueDeacon

04-14-2010 @ 7:56pm

Food? Shelter? Education? The extremely generous (enabling to the point of debilitating) U.S. governmental welfare system provides all of that and more.

Having been there myself, I can tell you from personal experience that there is no "generous welfare system" and that, in fact, you have to jump through a lot of hoops to get it in the first place (in fact, I was actually deemed ineligible for some benefits).

It was the well intentioned but ultimately failed policies of politicians like Lyndon B. Johnson that started the slide into generational welfare and dependency and poverty.

Correction -- it was already there when it happened, but people don't want to deal with that because they're looking for easy answers and a scapegoat. During the immediate post-World War II era folks with means lit out for the 'burbs, leaving center cities in the lurch (because they took their financial clout with them). No one on the political right is addressing that issue.

I just found out today that a teenage girl that I supported financially after she was expelled from the public school system and SWORE to me that all she wanted was "another chance" to get her diploma and go on to become an "astronaut or a pediatrician" has just gotten pregnant with her second oow child.

That's not a problem with "welfare"; she had emotional needs independent of the system that weren't being addressed in the process. (A girl of more means would likely have had an abortion -- something I'm sure you would have opposed as well.)

What do YOU do for The Poor? Besides encourage and assist and enable them to "work" the system and never, never, never do anything more than become a mother at 17 and a grandmother at 34?

I never said that they should "work the system" -- my church ministers to such people on a consistent basis. What's needed, however, is community (not just individual) access to resources such as jobs, education and the like; political power; encouraging of home ownership -- the kind of things that give a sense of roots. That's the big problem -- but one which I haven't heard any conservative espouse.

by: ley6224

04-19-2010 @ 5:21pm

From what I understand of the Bible, Christ's life, and God's will for us on Earth, we're supposed to find more useful things to spend our time on than piling up treasures here on earth. If you have a biblical basis for your theory, I'd be interested to hear it though.

I think personal responsibility is very important, and I think that most on this site would agree with me. Part of personal responsibly includes being responsible for the words you use to characterize other people. You posted on your site that those on THIS site are against personal responsibility. That is a wholly inaccurate portrayal of me and other advocates of a just world. All I'm saying is that in an effort to validate yourself, you seem to have purposely mischaracterized (slandered) others. Personal responsibility starts with yourself, and if you truly believe in that, then I believe you need to be honest in your portrayal of others. Loving your enemies (if you believe in that) means perhaps disagreeing with an idea but not slandering and lying about the person who says it (if you consider those your enemies or not). So until you begin practicing personal responsibility with your own words, you might want to refrain from preaching it to others.

by: SALLYFARRAR

04-14-2010 @ 7:40pm

Oh, please.

by: SALLYFARRAR

04-14-2010 @ 7:38pm

What do you call being left to "fend for oneself"?
Food? Shelter? Education? The extremely generous (enabling to the point of debilitating) U.S. governmental welfare system provides all of that and more. How much MORE do you think the government needs to do? How much MORE cash do you think the government needs to throw at these failed policies? What do you think will drive down the out of wedlock birth rate and make it less "cool" and less profitable for a young girl to have a baby? In the 1950's African American families were much more intact than they are now. The out of wedlock birth rate was a fraction of what it is now. The African American male was an integral part of his family unlike today where he is a sperm donor.
It was the well intentioned but ultimately failed policies of politicians like Lyndon B. Johnson that started the slide into generational welfare and dependency and poverty.
You will have to forgive my edge to this discussion. I just found out today that a teenage girl that I supported financially after she was expelled from the public school system and SWORE to me that all she wanted was "another chance" to get her diploma and go on to become an "astronaut or a pediatrician" has just gotten pregnant with her second oow child. I spent thousands of my own money to put her through a private, minority owned school only to have her kicked out of there for the usual reasons. One of the teachers kindly worked with her at home and hand fed her enough for her to obtain her GED. The FIRST thing she did was get pregnant (Check #1) and today her grandmother informed me that the girl is pregnant again (Check#2).
I asked her grandmother, "Why is she doing this?" The answer:
"The reason they all do it. For The Check."
So. She got her diploma. She had people lined up who were ready, willing and able to assist her, support her and pay for her to get more training and education. But she chose to stay out of the employment ranks and her career choice has been what millions of her female peers are doing. Have the baby. Get the check. It was the easy way out and even still....she is ticked off, angry, indignant, full of blame and a mother at 19.
What do YOU do for The Poor? Besides encourage and assist and enable them to "work" the system and never, never, never do anything more than become a mother at 17 and a grandmother at 34?

by: roger9192004

04-09-2010 @ 6:08am

Well, I thought it was kind of a joke labeling FDR as a marxist, because I don't think he was. I do appreciate some of what he says about "social justice." I was quoting him to show that the term has a respectable history apart from any linkage to marxism (ie I don't agree with Glenn Beck). What I'm wondering about is this statement of yours:
"Wow, are we losing our fellow Christian brothers, too, in this Spiritual battle for our Country? This blog is scaring me a little."
What is your fear that I am being lost to? Not the faith I hope. I do confess "Jesus is Lord" and I love the Lord with all my heart. I subscribe to the great historic Christian creeds and count myself as an evangelical. I'm not sure where you think "social justice" comes from, but I think it comes from Jesus himself who told us that we should "love our neighbors as ourselves." Perhaps we mean different things when we use the term, but that's just the point isn't it? Glenn Beck is dishonest when he accuses Jim Wallis of being a crypto marxist simply because he talks about biblical social justice, when even the most casual reading of any of Jim's writings would reveal that not to be true.

by: BlueDeacon

04-16-2010 @ 12:45am

No, you're being condescending to those beneath your station.

Anyway, here's why you're asking the wrong question.

What people are afraid of is losing their "authority" in society -- that they have the only voice worth heeding. Basically, they feel they have the "right" to rule and determine who's "in" and who's "out" and don't want anyone else to horn in on their action. What's more, they're so possessive of their status in society they consider it a "right" (and often confuse the two). A good example was in the movie "Cry Freedom" when a police captain said, "We're not going to roll over and give all this away."

by: sangerinde

04-09-2010 @ 8:49am

Can you please explain how agreeing with particular component ideas of a philosophy makes one a proponent of the whole philosophy? To me this is the larger logical fallacy at work here, more pertinent than "guilt by association."

Try this for a thought experiment: there are a lot of non-Christians walking around who think the Golden Rule is one of the soundest moral ideas ever. Does that make them Christians?

by: Tocqueville

04-09-2010 @ 6:57pm

Fellow brothers and sisters in Christ, separate yourselves from this false doctrine.

Yes exactly. youse, God Bless you. Your post is perfect. And with that I must wash my hands of this. The more I have looked into this "movement" the more it is becoming clear that there are some (perhaps many) that are using people (sheeple) and faith to forward a polical agenda. This is an abomination. Pray for discernment and may God Bless you and your families.

I'm sorry Dadofiandi but I do not have time to give you a proper history lesson here. Read some books...educate yourself on the true history (Original Intent would be a great book for you, again 5000 Year Leap is priceless) of America and it's founding. Don't be a fool.

Deacon sir, may I suggest Liberal Facism by Jonah Goldberg. I want to say Chapter 3 or 4 covers FDR. You'll understand once you read (don't get me wrong the whole book is an eye opener) it.

"Americans are taught from birth that they must overcome life's woes and impediments on their own. Social authority makes them mistrustful and anxious, and they rely upon its power only when they cannot do without it. This first becomes apparent in the schools, where children play by their own rules and punish infractions they define themselves. One encounters the same spirit in all aspects of social life. An obstruction blocks a public road, interrupting the flow of traffic. The neighbors immediately set up a deliberative body. Out of this improvised assembly comes an executive power that will remedy the ill before it occurs to anyone to appeal to an authority..."Tocqueville

The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money."

by: SALLYFARRAR

04-09-2010 @ 6:42pm

Hmmm. Who are you saying is cynical? Me? Resignation, maybe, but I hope not cynical. But I do realize that we live in a fallen world....and we are entering the end of the age when "what is right will seem wrong and what is wrong will seem right" therefore I remind myself not to expect but so much improvement when it concerns the human condition.
Even so, I have a heart for children and it does affect me when I see the suffering that they endure because of a failed welfare system that encourages and condones and subsidizes behavior that will never provide a helpless child with a loving, responsible, selfless set of parents.

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by: Jonahn

04-08-2010 @ 2:37am

yes, social upward mobility, as I said. Its hard to get out to the burbs if i dont have a car, if i dont have a drivers license, if i dont have money for gas, insurance, payments....

by: Jonahn

04-08-2010 @ 2:37am

yes, social upward mobility, as I said. Its hard to get out to the burbs if i dont have a car, if i dont have a drivers license, if i dont have money for gas, insurance, payments....

by: stljoie

04-08-2010 @ 3:31am

Jesus said "render unto Caesar what is Caesar's" ie" the government".
He also turned over the tables of gold in the house of worship. He also called on followers to leave behind homes and families and follow him. He also said "it is harder for a rich man to enter heaven than for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle". He also said " Do unto others as you would have them do unto you". When you lose your job, as I did, you will rejoice over the healthcare.

by: stljoie

04-08-2010 @ 3:31am

Jesus said "render unto Caesar what is Caesar's" ie" the government".
He also turned over the tables of gold in the house of worship. He also called on followers to leave behind homes and families and follow him. He also said "it is harder for a rich man to enter heaven than for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle". He also said " Do unto others as you would have them do unto you". When you lose your job, as I did, you will rejoice over the healthcare.

by: squeaky

04-08-2010 @ 3:34am

"A tax system only works when all the citizens produce and contribute to the system. EVERYONE..."

See, it is exactly comments like this that make it hard for me to believe your response to me that you do not judge anyone. Very few of your comments bear out such a loving attitude. You are saying that those who do not work have no worth or value, and yes, you are judging such people.

"God gave us all talents and abilities and I believe that it is a sin if we are not using those talents and abilities to profitably serve others."

You cannot determine that sin unless you are judging others and what they have or have not done with their talents and abilities.

"Why did Jesus destroy the fig tree? Not all of the fig trees just one."

You reference this scripture and try to tell me you don't judge? The difference between Jesus and you is that Jesus can see a person's full worth. So He has the authority to judge and damn the worthless fig tree. You do not.

The thing is, you place all this worth on a person's ability to works and how they contribute to society. Such an attitude is anti-Gospel. Not one of us is righteous, not one of us can gain Heaven or worth by our works or by how many hours we put in or how much we contribute to the whole. It is the very reason we need a Savior.

by: squeaky

04-08-2010 @ 3:34am

"A tax system only works when all the citizens produce and contribute to the system. EVERYONE..."

See, it is exactly comments like this that make it hard for me to believe your response to me that you do not judge anyone. Very few of your comments bear out such a loving attitude. You are saying that those who do not work have no worth or value, and yes, you are judging such people.

"God gave us all talents and abilities and I believe that it is a sin if we are not using those talents and abilities to profitably serve others."

You cannot determine that sin unless you are judging others and what they have or have not done with their talents and abilities.

"Why did Jesus destroy the fig tree? Not all of the fig trees just one."

You reference this scripture and try to tell me you don't judge? The difference between Jesus and you is that Jesus can see a person's full worth. So He has the authority to judge and damn the worthless fig tree. You do not.

The thing is, you place all this worth on a person's ability to works and how they contribute to society. Such an attitude is anti-Gospel. Not one of us is righteous, not one of us can gain Heaven or worth by our works or by how many hours we put in or how much we contribute to the whole. It is the very reason we need a Savior.

by: Jonahn

04-08-2010 @ 3:42am

squeaky, I wouldn't bother with John Clark anymore. He has this little website http://www.lifetosuccess.com/ , it appears he has quite the agenda. I don't think he's really interested in learning anything.

by: Jonahn

04-08-2010 @ 3:42am

squeaky, I wouldn't bother with John Clark anymore. He has this little website http://www.lifetosuccess.com/ , it appears he has quite the agenda. I don't think he's really interested in learning anything.

by: squeaky

04-08-2010 @ 3:43am

You are the first person I have seen come back from a mission trip gaining so much hatred and disgust for our nation's own needy. And these people you hold in such utter hateful contempt are the very people Jesus would spend all his time with if He were to come to visit us tomorrow. I wish you the ability to see them through Jesus' eyes.

by: squeaky

04-08-2010 @ 3:43am

You are the first person I have seen come back from a mission trip gaining so much hatred and disgust for our nation's own needy. And these people you hold in such utter hateful contempt are the very people Jesus would spend all his time with if He were to come to visit us tomorrow. I wish you the ability to see them through Jesus' eyes.

by: scat

04-08-2010 @ 4:40am

If anyone has a doubt about where all the vitriol and hatred comes from, all you have to do is read some of the comments here from the right-wingers. It's as though they descended on this sight like a plague of Biblical locusts. People are only valued for what they produce? Obviously a slam on what they consider welfare reciepients. What about the wealty "players" who do nothing constructive with thier lives other than feeding the consumer ecomony? What about the Wall Street "welfare" recipients? What about the poor people who have physical or mental disabilities? Thankfully, we have private and governmental programs that help people to do some construcitve work despite serious disabilities. A lot of people are poor because they can see no way out of thier circumstances and are in fact kept in those circumstances because those of us who can do have not done what is necessary to help them. If you ever talk to a welfare recipient, you will first find out that generally their lives are no picnic. Sometimes the solution to their problem is as simple as having better transportation to get to work, to get kids to school or daycare. Sometimes they cannot afford to go off welfare because thier net income would decline as a result of losing health care benefits or the cost of daycare. To just tell them to figure it out on their own because others have been able to do so is just plain cruel and not helpful.

The problem with stereotyping and then judging people is that often we are wrong and usually it is mean-spirited, certainly not reflective of God's spirit.

We all have a lot to contribute to solving our problems, but just sloshing stink on anyone you disagree with is no solution, more often it ends the inquiry. If someone has a novel idea, dismissing it out of hand because you differ on political ideology is counter-productive. And often the best way to get the best ideas is to compare ideas from a vareity of perspectives. If the only people you listen to think the same way you do, you reduce the chances of learning anything new.

by: scat

04-08-2010 @ 4:40am

If anyone has a doubt about where all the vitriol and hatred comes from, all you have to do is read some of the comments here from the right-wingers. It's as though they descended on this sight like a plague of Biblical locusts. People are only valued for what they produce? Obviously a slam on what they consider welfare reciepients. What about the wealty "players" who do nothing constructive with thier lives other than feeding the consumer ecomony? What about the Wall Street "welfare" recipients? What about the poor people who have physical or mental disabilities? Thankfully, we have private and governmental programs that help people to do some construcitve work despite serious disabilities. A lot of people are poor because they can see no way out of thier circumstances and are in fact kept in those circumstances because those of us who can do have not done what is necessary to help them. If you ever talk to a welfare recipient, you will first find out that generally their lives are no picnic. Sometimes the solution to their problem is as simple as having better transportation to get to work, to get kids to school or daycare. Sometimes they cannot afford to go off welfare because thier net income would decline as a result of losing health care benefits or the cost of daycare. To just tell them to figure it out on their own because others have been able to do so is just plain cruel and not helpful.

The problem with stereotyping and then judging people is that often we are wrong and usually it is mean-spirited, certainly not reflective of God's spirit.

We all have a lot to contribute to solving our problems, but just sloshing stink on anyone you disagree with is no solution, more often it ends the inquiry. If someone has a novel idea, dismissing it out of hand because you differ on political ideology is counter-productive. And often the best way to get the best ideas is to compare ideas from a vareity of perspectives. If the only people you listen to think the same way you do, you reduce the chances of learning anything new.

by: prgrs_ev

04-08-2010 @ 5:51am

"The problem, as I see it, is that the president has many people who are around him that believe in the philosophies of Marx and Mao...."

To be candid, this comment is slanderous drivel in the tradition of Glenn Beck and it belongs on the playground in age apprpropriate company and not in the discourse with adults...I've seen you present some defendable ideas and this isn't one of them in my opinion...

by: prgrs_ev

04-08-2010 @ 5:51am

"The problem, as I see it, is that the president has many people who are around him that believe in the philosophies of Marx and Mao...."

To be candid, this comment is slanderous drivel in the tradition of Glenn Beck and it belongs on the playground in age apprpropriate company and not in the discourse with adults...I've seen you present some defendable ideas and this isn't one of them in my opinion...

by: prgrs_ev

04-08-2010 @ 5:56am

Have you read Marx???

by: prgrs_ev

04-08-2010 @ 5:56am

Have you read Marx???

by: prgrs_ev

04-08-2010 @ 6:05am

After you read Marx maybe a course in hermaneutics would help...if the Bible is not a book about the Christian walk of faith then a couple of millenia has been wasted by a lot of people...

by: prgrs_ev

04-08-2010 @ 6:05am

After you read Marx maybe a course in hermaneutics would help...if the Bible is not a book about the Christian walk of faith then a couple of millenia has been wasted by a lot of people...

by: Ivriniel

04-08-2010 @ 6:12am

"The problem, as I see it, is that the president has many people who are around him that believe in the philosophies of Marx and Mao and that is exactly what our founders were trying to get us away from when they claimed our independence as a country."

Given that neither Marx nor Mao were born at the time your country got its independence, I rather doubt your founders were trying to get away from their philosophies.

by: Ivriniel

04-08-2010 @ 6:12am

"The problem, as I see it, is that the president has many people who are around him that believe in the philosophies of Marx and Mao and that is exactly what our founders were trying to get us away from when they claimed our independence as a country."

Given that neither Marx nor Mao were born at the time your country got its independence, I rather doubt your founders were trying to get away from their philosophies.

by: Ivriniel

04-08-2010 @ 6:21am

That list is a pretty thin evidence. It's point form, without any explanation, of its points, or any references. And some of it is downright nonsensical. For example I don't see how the fact that Stanley Ann Dunham moved from Hawaii to Indonesia and Pakistan proves anything about her political affiliations.

You may not be actively lying, but you're choosing to believe and quote a very dubious source there.

by: Ivriniel

04-08-2010 @ 6:21am

That list is a pretty thin evidence. It's point form, without any explanation, of its points, or any references. And some of it is downright nonsensical. For example I don't see how the fact that Stanley Ann Dunham moved from Hawaii to Indonesia and Pakistan proves anything about her political affiliations.

You may not be actively lying, but you're choosing to believe and quote a very dubious source there.

by: Ivriniel

04-08-2010 @ 6:24am

How is the Health Care Bill taxation without representation?

You have your Representatives. They voted. The Bill passed. It's how your democracy works.

by: Ivriniel

04-08-2010 @ 6:24am

How is the Health Care Bill taxation without representation?

You have your Representatives. They voted. The Bill passed. It's how your democracy works.

by: Ivriniel

04-08-2010 @ 6:36am

I for one, am not ashamed of the gospel of Jesus Christ, who was anointed to bring good news to the poor, proclaim release to the captives and recovery of sight to the blind, to let the oppressed go free and to proclaim the year of the Lord's favour.

by: Ivriniel

04-08-2010 @ 6:36am

I for one, am not ashamed of the gospel of Jesus Christ, who was anointed to bring good news to the poor, proclaim release to the captives and recovery of sight to the blind, to let the oppressed go free and to proclaim the year of the Lord's favour.

by: John Clark

04-08-2010 @ 9:29am

For someone who is all about non-judgement, you are doing a lot of judging.

Why do you think the Bible was written? It was to give us a guide to live our lives by.

As I get bombarded by several of you on here, I am being nothing but judged.

But as I see it based on the responses, there are a lot of people that want the system to change instead of the person having to make a change.

The system has been around since the beginning of time, if you read the Bible.

There have been times of prosperity and freedom followed by times of bondage and tyranny. And this pattern repeats itself over and over in the Bible.

We just happen to be going into a time of bondage and tyranny with government over regulation of every aspect of our lives and it appears only to be getting worse, if we let it continue.

I don't stand in judgement of anyone, only God has that right but I do read the Bible and I do observe what is going on around me, just like you.

But point of view is just a little different then yours.

by: John Clark

04-08-2010 @ 9:29am

For someone who is all about non-judgement, you are doing a lot of judging.

Why do you think the Bible was written? It was to give us a guide to live our lives by.

As I get bombarded by several of you on here, I am being nothing but judged.

But as I see it based on the responses, there are a lot of people that want the system to change instead of the person having to make a change.

The system has been around since the beginning of time, if you read the Bible.

There have been times of prosperity and freedom followed by times of bondage and tyranny. And this pattern repeats itself over and over in the Bible.

We just happen to be going into a time of bondage and tyranny with government over regulation of every aspect of our lives and it appears only to be getting worse, if we let it continue.

I don't stand in judgement of anyone, only God has that right but I do read the Bible and I do observe what is going on around me, just like you.

But point of view is just a little different then yours.

by: Jonahn

04-08-2010 @ 10:42am

"Why do you think the Bible was written? It was to give us a guide to live our lives by."

This absolutely belittles the Bible. The Bible is God's Word, it gives us truth, it tells us about God's love, our sin, the salvation that he gives us through the resurrection, about his Kingdom come. The Bible is not a 'how to' guide. Is that what you tell people on your website lifetosuccess.com?

"There have been times of prosperity and freedom followed by times of bondage and tyranny. And this pattern repeats itself over and over in the Bible.

We just happen to be going into a time of bondage and tyranny with government over regulation of every aspect of our lives and it appears only to be getting worse, if we let it continue."

honestly? you are comparing our society right now and the freedoms we have to israelites building bricks in egypt in pharaoh's empire? lets have some real discourse, not irrationality.

by: Jonahn

04-08-2010 @ 10:42am

"Why do you think the Bible was written? It was to give us a guide to live our lives by."

This absolutely belittles the Bible. The Bible is God's Word, it gives us truth, it tells us about God's love, our sin, the salvation that he gives us through the resurrection, about his Kingdom come. The Bible is not a 'how to' guide. Is that what you tell people on your website lifetosuccess.com?

"There have been times of prosperity and freedom followed by times of bondage and tyranny. And this pattern repeats itself over and over in the Bible.

We just happen to be going into a time of bondage and tyranny with government over regulation of every aspect of our lives and it appears only to be getting worse, if we let it continue."

honestly? you are comparing our society right now and the freedoms we have to israelites building bricks in egypt in pharaoh's empire? lets have some real discourse, not irrationality.

by: squeaky

04-08-2010 @ 11:30am

"Why do you think the Bible was written? It was to give us a guide to live our lives by."

You have turned the Bible into a self-help book. It is not. It isn't about accumulating wealth or success or even happiness in this world. It is about relationship to the One who loves you, created you, and died for you.

In your comments and your website, you seem to value that which God does not value and devalue that which He paid for with His life.

But you were bought with a very high price, a price you can by no means pay back no matter what you do, how much wealth you accumulate, or how much worldly success you achieve. You have done nothing to deserve such a sacrifice, and He died for you in spite of the fact you have absolutely nothing to offer Him in return. And without that understanding, it becomes very easy to see others as "less than".

by: squeaky

04-08-2010 @ 11:30am

"Why do you think the Bible was written? It was to give us a guide to live our lives by."

You have turned the Bible into a self-help book. It is not. It isn't about accumulating wealth or success or even happiness in this world. It is about relationship to the One who loves you, created you, and died for you.

In your comments and your website, you seem to value that which God does not value and devalue that which He paid for with His life.

But you were bought with a very high price, a price you can by no means pay back no matter what you do, how much wealth you accumulate, or how much worldly success you achieve. You have done nothing to deserve such a sacrifice, and He died for you in spite of the fact you have absolutely nothing to offer Him in return. And without that understanding, it becomes very easy to see others as "less than".

by: NC77

04-08-2010 @ 12:28pm

I would agree with John Clark. If you do not watch Beck on a regular basis, it is easy to draw the wrong conclusion. So isn't Dr. Dixon doing the same she accuses Beck off?

You state:

"Dr. Dixon's argument is that "Beck's logical error is where he thinks that if someone uses a term such as social justice or redistribution of wealth that this makes her the same as every other person or organization that uses the term."

If you watched the show on a regular basis you would know this is not Beck's logic. He clearly makes a distinction between the government driven social justice of Wallis, Wright, Black Liberation Theology, Soros, Pelosi, etc., and the social justice of Jesus and Christians giving of their private wealth to those in need.

When Jesus gave to the poor he did not take from the government to do it. He gave of what he had himself through his trust and relationship with God the Father, plus what the disciples had to give, or what individuals he interacted with were willing to give.

Look at an annual report for Sojourners and you will see if they believe in giving from their means to support the poor or if they are only intesrested in government activism on the corporate level.

by: NC77

04-08-2010 @ 12:28pm

I would agree with John Clark. If you do not watch Beck on a regular basis, it is easy to draw the wrong conclusion. So isn't Dr. Dixon doing the same she accuses Beck off?

You state:

"Dr. Dixon's argument is that "Beck's logical error is where he thinks that if someone uses a term such as social justice or redistribution of wealth that this makes her the same as every other person or organization that uses the term."

If you watched the show on a regular basis you would know this is not Beck's logic. He clearly makes a distinction between the government driven social justice of Wallis, Wright, Black Liberation Theology, Soros, Pelosi, etc., and the social justice of Jesus and Christians giving of their private wealth to those in need.

When Jesus gave to the poor he did not take from the government to do it. He gave of what he had himself through his trust and relationship with God the Father, plus what the disciples had to give, or what individuals he interacted with were willing to give.

Look at an annual report for Sojourners and you will see if they believe in giving from their means to support the poor or if they are only intesrested in government activism on the corporate level.

by: NC77

04-08-2010 @ 12:31pm

Van Jones (resigned, but still influential to the administration). Anne Dunn (she may have resigned also because of here admiration of Mao).

by: NC77

04-08-2010 @ 12:31pm

Van Jones (resigned, but still influential to the administration). Anne Dunn (she may have resigned also because of here admiration of Mao).

by: NC77

04-08-2010 @ 12:37pm

"my sense is that the self-righteous spirit of the anti-war movement of the late 60s, early 70s, is no longer such a prominent feature in the worldview of Jim Wallis or others associated with Sojourners."

Unfortunately, that is who is running the government now (the movers from the 60s and 70s). And in my opinion they haven't changed. They just changed the way they talk about it.

by: NC77

04-08-2010 @ 12:37pm

"my sense is that the self-righteous spirit of the anti-war movement of the late 60s, early 70s, is no longer such a prominent feature in the worldview of Jim Wallis or others associated with Sojourners."

Unfortunately, that is who is running the government now (the movers from the 60s and 70s). And in my opinion they haven't changed. They just changed the way they talk about it.

by: NC77

04-08-2010 @ 12:40pm

The mainstream media ingnored all the evidence of what Obama is during the campaign. Only a few media outlets were telling the truth about Obama's past and the relationships that shaped his worldview. That is why many people voted for him and now regret it.

by: NC77

04-08-2010 @ 12:40pm

The mainstream media ingnored all the evidence of what Obama is during the campaign. Only a few media outlets were telling the truth about Obama's past and the relationships that shaped his worldview. That is why many people voted for him and now regret it.

by: NC77

04-08-2010 @ 2:05pm

...we need the power of the Holy Spirit to bring justice.

Amen. There are many scriptures that confirm what you say. One of my favorites is Ephesians 5:15-18

by: NC77

04-08-2010 @ 2:05pm

...we need the power of the Holy Spirit to bring justice.

Amen. There are many scriptures that confirm what you say. One of my favorites is Ephesians 5:15-18

by: NC77

04-08-2010 @ 2:07pm

How would you equalize this unjust system you speak of? Socialism? What is your answer to all the self imposed victomhood we have in this country?

by: NC77

04-08-2010 @ 2:07pm

How would you equalize this unjust system you speak of? Socialism? What is your answer to all the self imposed victomhood we have in this country?

by: Janice_M

04-08-2010 @ 2:42pm

Conditioning asked: ".. who does President Obama keep around that follow the "philosophies of Marx and Mao?" ..Do you have verifiable sources for this outrageous claim?"

I see you have a problem with "the philosophies of Marx and Mao".

Jim Wallis doesn't.

by: Janice_M

04-08-2010 @ 2:42pm

Conditioning asked: ".. who does President Obama keep around that follow the "philosophies of Marx and Mao?" ..Do you have verifiable sources for this outrageous claim?"

I see you have a problem with "the philosophies of Marx and Mao".

Jim Wallis doesn't.

by: BlueDeacon

04-08-2010 @ 2:49pm

I'm in the mainstream media, and I can assure you that we did no such thing. There was a lot of propaganda out there, some insisting that Obama was a Muslim and other saying he was a Communist (if you're one you can't be the other) that could never be nailed down because it wasn't true. As for people voting for him and now regretting it, the same could be said for almost any politician, especially a president. And here's a prediction: Obama will win in a landslide in 2012 should he decide to run again.

by: BlueDeacon

04-08-2010 @ 2:49pm

I'm in the mainstream media, and I can assure you that we did no such thing. There was a lot of propaganda out there, some insisting that Obama was a Muslim and other saying he was a Communist (if you're one you can't be the other) that could never be nailed down because it wasn't true. As for people voting for him and now regretting it, the same could be said for almost any politician, especially a president. And here's a prediction: Obama will win in a landslide in 2012 should he decide to run again.

by: tencommandments

04-08-2010 @ 3:26pm

You are absolutely correct. We should not be ashamed of the gospel of Christ.
However, when you take the word of God and use it to perpetuate untruths, to divert the real issues, Then yes, you should be ashamed of yourself.
We should read the Bible in it's entirety and place it before anyone else. When you take excerpts from it, to go after an individual, group or company, a person should be ashamed.
That is why this website and Mr. Wallis should be ashamed of themselves.

by: tencommandments

04-08-2010 @ 3:26pm

You are absolutely correct. We should not be ashamed of the gospel of Christ.
However, when you take the word of God and use it to perpetuate untruths, to divert the real issues, Then yes, you should be ashamed of yourself.
We should read the Bible in it's entirety and place it before anyone else. When you take excerpts from it, to go after an individual, group or company, a person should be ashamed.
That is why this website and Mr. Wallis should be ashamed of themselves.