On Glenn Beck and the Restoring Honor Rally (Part I)

This whole sentence of Ms. Dixon's is intellectually dishonest: "I am a Christian, and I am not ashamed of the gospel of Jesus Christ. However, Jesus is not the God of America, and the United States is not a Christian nation. To make Jesus the God of America is to make Jesus too small. To make Christianity the religion of the nation makes every citizen of any other religion or citizens who confess no religious faith second-class citizens. It would impose a religious test on elected officials (an unconstitutional de facto reality in most cases already). It would deceive us and the world into thinking that every war we fight is a Christian crusade. The United States is and ought to remain a non-sectarian republic.

I'm afraid no religion for a nation is more dangerous than one that adheres to Christian principles. Jesus said unto the people that followed him, "I say unto you, I have not found so great faith, no, not in Israel" (Luke 7:9). Religion cannot be divorced from one's civic activity if government is "by the people and for the people." Religion is inherent in one's being, and it goes part and parcel with one's enactment of human government.

I find it interesting what "Christians" will do when Christ sets up His Kingdom on earth during the Kingdom Age. When the LORD as king over all the earth (Zechariah 14:9), judging the nations for their treatment of the Jews, and reigning with him in peace and righteousness for one thousand years and safety and prosperity throughout the earth, and nature will be restored to its original beauty. What will you do with that mix of civil religion and government, BlueDeacon?

I'm afraid it is the point when she claim that civil religion is dangerous. Jesus said unto the people that followed him, "I say unto you, I have not found so great faith, no, not in Israel" (Luke 7:9). Religion cannot be divorced from one's civic activity if government is "by the people and for the people." Religion is inherent in one's being, and it goes part and parcel with one's enactment of human government.

I find it interesting what "Christians" will do when Christ sets up His Kingdom on earth during the Kingdom Age. When the LORD as king over all the earth (Zechariah 14:9), judging the nations for their treatment of the Jews, and reigning with him in peace and righteousness for one thousand years and safety and prosperity throughout the earth, and nature will be restored to its original beauty. What will you do with that mix of civil religion and government, BlueDeacon?

I am looking forward to seeing Dr. Dixon's Part 2. There are some questions in my own mind, that I hope she can answer.

I did some reading on the Black Robed Regiment. These are preachers from the time of the Revolutionary War. Not only did they used the pulpit to boldly preach on the issues of the day and to call out those who supported the British. They were also prepared to fight with guns.

Okay, what can we expect from Beck's group of Black Robed Regiment? Where did this come from? I suspect David Barton had a hand in this. He called this "The return of the Black Robed Regiment" What are these guys going to do, that they haven't already been doing?

Am I the only one who is thinking God is up to something? What is God purposing in this? My own prayer is, "If this is not of God then let it be exposed as such and an ending of it! If it is indeed of God; let it bear fruit!"

I'm afraid it is the point when she claim that civil religion is dangerous. Jesus said unto the people that followed him, "I say unto you, I have not found so great faith, no, not in Israel" (Luke 7:9). Religion cannot be divorced from one's civic activity if government is "by the people and for the people." Religion is inherent in one's being, and it goes part and parcel with one's enactment of human government.

Keep in mind, however, that ancient Israel was the only nation-state that God Himself ordained, so the parallels don't quite exist. Besides, it's capable to love one's country and yet pledge allegiance to a higher King; my pastor has said, "I love my country, but it is not the Kingdom of God." We'd better not confuse the two.

When the LORD as king over all the earth (Zechariah 14:9), judging the nations for their treatment of the Jews, and reigning with him in peace and righteousness for one thousand years and safety and prosperity throughout the earth, and nature will be restored to its original beauty. What will you do with that mix of civil religion and government, BlueDeacon?

That's a very bad question for reasons I just mentioned. BTW, "a thousand years" in that culture isn't literal but represents a euphemism for "forever" -- an example was, in the movie "The Ten Commandments," Moses said to Pharaoh, "Let this prove my loyalty for a thousand years."

It is a shame that people that call themselves Christians don't believe the Bible. These scriptures need no interpretation:
"And he gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue ARMAGEDDON" (Rev. 16:16), and, "I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a THOUSAND YEARS" (Rev. 20:4). Pretty plain establishment of the death of the wicked and the entrance of the reign of Christ!

If there were no intended manipulation of public fervor to vote for a particular political party in the upcoming elections, I might have a less cynical view of the "rally" for honor etc., but the key point that Dr. Dixon points out is the incredible disconnect between the pacifism and non-violence practiced by the late Dr. King, which is directly based on the Gospel itself, and the civil religion which elevates killings of others in the name of God and country into virtue rather than violence.

I remember a poem I once saw by a Vietnam veteran, whose name I cannot remember, which was modelled after Jesus words. Although the original words were more eloquent, it was to the effect of "You were hungry, I destroyed your rice fields, you were cold, I burned your villages, then ending with the verse, whatsoever you do to the least of these, you have done it to me also."

Count Leo Tolstoy made the simple but profound argument in his Confessions that the pure truth of Jesus' teachings about how we treat our neighbors and our enemies is NOT reconcilable with any kind of militarism or nationalism. Our Quaker, Mennonite, and Amish brethren have kept that truth alive in the West, but most Christians never question the contradictions involved in the last 1000 plus years of the organized churches. Perhaps it's time to acknowledge that discrepancy in our culture, and decide which priority to claim, loyalty to a nation-state, or devotion to the Good News?

It never ceases to amaze me that devout Christians who insist upon an absolute literal interpretation of the first Chapter of Genesis are able to bypass "Love your enemies, and bless those who curse you" , and "thou shalt not kill" completely when there is a sacred uniform involved.

Please do not misunderstand. I understand that it is a sinful world, and I do believe that God can and does forgive our soldiers for their actions if they ask for His forgiveness (and I do not doubt that most do in fact truly regret the unspeakable things they have endured, and carry those scars of the evils of war on their hearts forever.) It is more those of the Civil religious on the homefront who seem eager for war, and who glorify those sacrifices in the name of the Prince of Peace that offend both my faith, and my concern for the young men and women whose scars are unnecessary and unjustly concentrated among the poor, and whose very civil religions may have preached to them a hatred of our enemies, as if that were somehow Christ's position.

Frankly, as an anthropologist, I have to say that across time and space, the Biblical teaching seems to square up with the fact that violence begets more violence, and the rise of the state has resulted in greater scale of conflict, bloodshed, and social stratification than ever existed in "simpler" societies. Even in a post 9/11 world, fear and insecurity ought not to blind us to the need to truly practice what we preach.

Dr. Dixon has nailed it spot on. What Beck/Palin were up to at this completely bought and paid for rally was a classic exercise in American Civil Religion.

American Civil Religion traces back at least to Abraham Lincoln (so curiously abhorred by Xfree9) who in his famous Lyceum speech wrote: "Let reverence for the laws, be breathed by every American mother, to the lisping babe, that prattles on her lap -- let it be taught in schools, in seminaries, and in colleges; -- let it be written in Primmers, spelling books and in Almanacs; -- let it be preached from the pulpit, proclaimed in legislative halls, and enforced in courts of justice. And, in short, let it become the political religion of the nation; and let the old and the young, the rich and the poor, the grave and the gay, of all sexes and tongues, and colors and conditions, sacrifice unceasingly upon its altars."

Although I suspect both Beck and Palin would resent being discovered to be in any real agreement with the Great Emancipator, they not only agree with Lincoln's perspective but significantly enlarge it.

Their equation of martial virtue with moral virtue and that virtue being founded on the one, only and true interpretation the foundational, immutable, inerrant primary documents of the nation

"Although I suspect both Beck and Palin would resent being discovered to be in any real agreement with the Great Emancipator, they not only agree with Lincoln's perspective but significantly enlarge it. "

What do you mean by this?

Interesting post. Some good points made.
Couple of thoughts:
What are the points made at Saturday's rally that Dr. Dixon would agree with? Following on that - what would religion & patriotism properly look like?
Responding to the note about Julia Ward Howe, we are fortunate to live in a time that our military is not compulsory, and only those who have reached 18 years of age can sign up. Having said that - I think God has a special love for mothers who let their sons & daughters serve the country through the military, and we ought to acknowledge that wherever we can.
Finally - Jesus made the final sacrifice on the cross, but His sacrifice does not end the reality of nations attacking one another, until He makes His return. Any nation needs to have a well-formed military to safeguard its identity & interests. The US is no exception. Perhaps paradoxically, we can pursue peacekeeping goals successfully only when we have a strong military.

Really? I'm afraid you're being intellectually dishonest by refusing the relationship God has in the affairs of ruling His people. The Old and New Testaments are chock full of references to theocratic forms of government--remember that the Jews were given Kings (Presidents and ruler--another form of government) because everyone did that which was right in their own, and not God's sight (Judges 21:25). We, as a Gentile nation, are called to be God's holy nation, and just as the Jews, we are grafted into the Jewish stock.

Your God and His Kingdom is always superior to your country, and the Kingdom of God is with you, so yes, there's no confusion and the the LORD IS king over all the earth (Zechariah 14:9)!

That's a very good question--one that you avoid answering. So, what will it be, BlueDeacon? What will you do in the Millennium?

What does that have to do with it? We Christians are not supposed to participate in "culture (read: turf) wars" to prove the superiority of Jesus -- the Puritans tried and failed miserably at "Christianizing" the world, which is why they got thrown out of every country in Europe where they had a presence (and I come from a Reformed theological perspective, so in one sense I'm criticizing myself).

Rather, if we want to go back to the perspective of the early church, it was often on the run and had few friends and yet grew exponentially because it was a true counter-culture movement that offered something different from the rest of the world of that day. Today, however, we've basically watered down the demands of the Gospel, focusing on "fire insurance," felt needs and power politics rather than on God's claims on His people.

To answer your question, it's still irrelevant because we don't know exactly what the rule of Christ come to fruition will actually look like. It's up to the church, however, to give a hint.

Uh -- they actually do. Most everything in the book of the Revelation is symbolic and doesn't point to upcoming events; I attended a Bible study on the book two years ago, and I can assure you that much of what's accepted as "biblical" is completely misinterpreted and taken out of context. Remember, that was merely a series of visions that John had, and the book was meant to encourage Jewish believers who were suffering for the faith.

I can see that you're a dispensationalist -- however, I am not and never was.

Moreover, you interpret the Scripture in a Western context, which is a

huge mistake. As I mentioned before, in that context "a thousand

years" is a euphemism for "forever," and -- sorry to say -- there will be no

such thing as "Armageddon." As I said, the church of today is to model

the reign of Christ, not necessarily to establish it.

Really? I'm afraid you're being intellectually dishonest by refusing the relationship God has in the affairs of ruling His people. The Old and New Testaments are chock full of references to theocratic forms of government--remember that the Jews were given Kings (Presidents and ruler--another form of government) because everyone did that which was right in their own, and not God's sight (Judges 21:25). We, as a Gentile nation, are called to be God's holy nation, and just as the Jews, we are grafted into the Jewish stock.

Your God and His Kingdom is always superior to your country, and the Kingdom of God is with you, so yes, there's no confusion and the the LORD IS king over all the earth (Zechariah 14:9)!

That's a very good question--one that you avoid answering. So, what will it be, BlueDeacon? What will you do in the Millennium?

Glenn Beck's Restoring Honor rally in Washington D.C. was based around America's return to its roots and God. The speeches given by Beck and his guests were religious in nature, asking the listeners to remember the hardships of those that came to America for religious freedom. There is also an emphasis placed on the military and those killed for American freedom and justice. The emotionality of the speakers is very strong, they rely on appealing to the listeners' feelings. Through sad stories of fallen military officers and an inflated sense of pride Beck incites those that came to listen.
Beck is known for his emotional and passionate speeches so it comes as no surprise that he took the same approach to his Restoring Honor rally. Within the first few minutes Beck's voice wavers as if he is going to cry. All of the speakers appeal to emotion more than logic, especially through religion. The speeches made inspire those that already agree with them, but the lack of Logos emphasis makes them seem ridiculous and unconvincing to those with opposing views. There is no voice given to those opposing views either, making the speeches very one-sided. Beck does not use logical language, but emotional language. He also repeats some words such as "beyond" in the beginning to emphasize his point. This style of speaking does not offer more information but rather cements the phrases in the mind of the listener. Beck's rally seems convincing but when one realizes it is directed almost exclusively at the emotions, the message loses its soundness.

Megan Cott

Boy you writers at sojourners really hold a grudge. When you go out to destroy someone you dont let up. Doesnt look very christian like to go after a guy like this. His rally was very well attend and left the place niceer then when they got there. All about restoreing faith and honor within ourselves so the future people of america including politicians will have the same gualities faith and honor. Man such a horrible concept. It wasnt a tea party movement protest which those of the naacp might have you think wasnt a protest like Jim Wallace made you think wasnt anything you all stated it would be so we wiggle in silly notions and ideas to keep casting a bad light on him. heaven forbid anyone think for a moment he has any good ideas.

I can see how someone who espouses a religion-free civil government can't appreciate that the Millennial Reign of Christ. I can understand why the LORD as king over all the earth that day, one LORD, and his name one can make you uncomfortable! Itmust make you very nervous thinking that the Church will sit beside Jesus judging the nations for their treatment of the Jews and reigning with him in peace and righteousness for one thousand years, and that men and women will be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years" (Revelation 20:6; Zechariah 14:9).

No one has to prove the superiority of Jesus--He is, and always will be, the Supreme Ruler of the affairs of men. And the true Church will never stop evangelizing the whole world and ushering Christ into the aftermath of Armageddon!

Hold on a minute -- the problem was that Beck laid bare the "sins" of some unnamed other side that we need to defeat, which is still part and part of the "culture war" that the Scripture never tells us to fight (in that sense it actually was a "tea-party" protest, albeit just dressed up). However, when King spoke in 1963 his message was one of justice and reconciliation, exactly the opposite.

I remember my mom explaining to me once, that a man accused of sexually abusing his children in our denomination, "wouldn't do that because he was a Christian!"

My parents have also applied that same argument to Sarah Palin, who attended the same denominational church as my family. She must be called of God for such a time as this, because she was an Assembly of God member.

The examples of this type of thinking or non thinking are abundant in those who speak rhetoric over substance to prove their right to be right.

If you preface any belief with a reference to God, you have to be right. An American, who believes in God has to be politically correct. A politician, who quotes the bible, can't possibly be corrupt.

There is no amount of reasoning or logic or facts that can correct this belief with some "fundamentalists". Today even Rush Limbaugh, who can throw a few God comments in his commentary, is considered believable. My parents, as well as other Christian friends tell me he wouldn't lie. He is human and has made mistakes but he believes in God.

The idolatry for me then becomes the movement itself. It is born of fervor and belief that is unwilling to look at any evidence contrary to its own statements. Because the goal is to follow God, to question is to be godless. That is a form of manipulation and mind control, using propaganda-like tactics and that is what scares me.

The proof in the pudding for me is to see what kind of fruit is demonstrated if you disagree or question any tenets on any level of any of these so-called prophets. If you are publicly castrated as an unbeliever then, there you go.

Glenn Beck's Restoring Honor rally in Washington D.C. was based around America's return to its roots and God. The speeches given by Beck and his guests were religious in nature, asking the listeners to remember the hardships of those that came to America for religious freedom. There is also an emphasis placed on the military and those killed for American freedom and justice. The emotionality of the speakers is very strong, they rely on appealing to the listeners' feelings. Through sad stories of fallen military officers and an inflated sense of pride Beck incites those that came to listen.
Beck is known for his emotional and passionate speeches so it comes as no surprise that he took the same approach to his Restoring Honor rally. Within the first few minutes Beck's voice wavers as if he is going to cry. All of the speakers appeal to emotion more than logic, especially through religion. The speeches made inspire those that already agree with them, but the lack of Logos emphasis makes them seem ridiculous and unconvincing to those with opposing views. There is no voice given to those opposing views either, making the speeches very one-sided. Beck does not use logical language, but emotional language. He also repeats some words such as "beyond" in the beginning to emphasize his point. This style of speaking does not offer more information but rather cements the phrases in the mind of the listener. Beck's rally seems convincing but when one realizes it is directed almost exclusively at the emotions, the message loses its soundness.

Megan Cott

That wasn't an issue for the early Christians, who in one sense had no country; they refused to (indeed, probably could not) ally themselves with any state lest they fall into idolatry.

Please check your facts: Palin was in the Assembly of God church and the AOG believes in speaking in tongues as the scripture in the book of Acts and 1 Corinthians clearly describes. This is what the Pentecostal faith is all about! And albeit, the AOG church doesn't require the Holy Ghost experience be experienced by all of their parishioners, they do believe that the Holy Ghost baptism is evidenced by speaking in other tongues as the Spirit gives the utterance. What really perturbs me is the way some cast a negative light on this experience, however, it is quite common for those who do cast aspersions on this glossalalia experience--they seem quite comfortable throwing the apostles out with the baptismal bath water, so to speak!

I can't more heartily disagree with the statement, "To make Jesus the God of America is to make Jesus too small." To do anything less would be making Him less than His omniscience, omnipotence and omnipresence demands and deserves! Jesus Christ has always been, and always will be the God of this nation because there is no other God! (As a Christian, you should not only know this, but you should also express it, as it is the basic tenet of your faith). Not only should America retain Christianity as the religion of our nation, but also the religion of every other nation; Those who confess no religious faith are hopelessly loss with Him, and frankly, Ms. Dixon, those nations are destined for failure in the end without Jesus Christ as their God.

I remember my mom explaining to me once, that a man accused of sexually abusing his children in our denomination, "wouldn't do that because he was a Christian!"

My parents have also applied that same argument to Sarah Palin, who attended the same denominational church as my family. She must be called of God for such a time as this, because she was an Assembly of God member.

The examples of this type of thinking or non thinking are abundant in those who speak rhetoric over substance to prove their right to be right.

If you preface any belief with a reference to God, you have to be right. An American, who believes in God has to be politically correct. A politician, who quotes the bible, can't possibly be corrupt.

There is no amount of reasoning or logic or facts that can correct this belief with some "fundamentalists". Today even Rush Limbaugh, who can throw a few God comments in his commentary, is considered believable. My parents, as well as other Christian friends tell me he wouldn't lie. He is human and has made mistakes but he believes in God.

The idolatry for me then becomes the movement itself. It is born of fervor and belief that is unwilling to look at any evidence contrary to its own statements. Because the goal is to follow God, to question is to be godless. That is a form of manipulation and mind control, using propaganda-like tactics and that is what scares me.

The proof in the pudding for me is to see what kind of fruit is demonstrated if you disagree or question any tenets on any level of any of these so-called prophets. If you are publicly castrated as an unbeliever then, there you go.